Question re: ammo authenticity/safety

[NMRMN]

Question for reloaders and those knowledgeable about ammo in general. I came across some loose packed 5.56 M193 and SS109 (not green tipped, but core attracts magnet, and profile consistent with M855). I have come to question whether or not they are handloads, even though they were said to be factory (LC Brass, 07-08 I believe, NATO headstamp).

Is there a way to verify their authenticity? The primers on the SS109, being silver instead of brass color gave me pause, as well as the bullet not being painted green. Is there any way to objectively test the veracity of the origin and thus the safety of this ammo? I can add pics if that helps. Thanks!

[DoxaPar]

Is there a crimp on the primer?

[DoxaPar]

Also, any marks on the extraction rim?

[NMRMN]

Re:: crimped – I believe so -- I'm just gonna go get a couple good pictures of them

[OldmanFCSA]

Several years ago (recently), Federal was selling loose packed boxes of 5.56X45 in quantities of 500 per box or 1000 per box.
They did the same for 7.62X51.
I bought several thousand of each, with 5.56 going for $109/1000 and 7.62 going for $134/1000. Later versions of this sale went to $99/500, $189/1000 for 5.56, and $109/500 and $199/1000 for 7.62.
It was loaded to military specs BUT was not certified for military or law enforcement usage.
It shot well.
Still have some.

NO - NOT FOR SALE.

[Hoot]

Some de-milling processes involve pulling down the cartridges to the discrete components and selling them to a company that puts them back together. I know, it's ludicrous, but that's how current laws deal with surplus military ammunition. I've purchased XM193 that had the crimps already removed, but otherwise looked identical and even came in the same brown boxes as the original ammunition. Shot like it too. Some XM193 produced at the Federal plant has silver cup primers. When I'm sorting brass, that's the easiest way to quickly segregate them from the LC without putting my glasses on.

Hoot

[NMRMN]

SS109

IMG_5370.jpg

M193

IMG_5369.jpg

[NMRMN]

Several years ago (recently), Federal was selling loose packed boxes of 5.56X45 in quantities of 500 per box or 1000 per box.
They did the same for 7.62X51.
I bought several thousand of each, with 5.56 going for $109/1000 and 7.62 going for $134/1000. Later versions of this sale went to $99/500, $189/1000 for 5.56, and $109/500 and $199/1000 for 7.62.
It was loaded to military specs BUT was not certified for military or law enforcement usage.
It shot well.
Still have some.

NO - NOT FOR SALE.

What year were yours? Yeah these came in 500ct loose bags with a simple white label on 'em. The case mouth doesn't seem heat treated either (sealed?), like I have seen on other batches. Heat marks could have rubbed off being loose packed I suppose.

[rtwills]

The necks should be annealed and if they were reloaded you should be able to see a ring around the case just above the groove at the base left from the sizing die.

[NMRMN]

The necks should be annealed and if they were reloaded you should be able to see a ring around the case just above the groove at the base left from the sizing die.

Definitely not annealed -- but is all federal/lake city 556? Wonder if Oldman's are. I am not as concerned about them being reloaded, as they don't have any extraction marks, and don't see a ring that you mention... but could they be hand loaded (by who?). I have no real reason to mistrust the supplier, but no reason to trust them either. My concern is just what level of safety threat they present, not being sure of the authenticity.

[OldmanFCSA]

Mine were/are in standard brown cardboard boxes, NOT IN A PLASTIC BAG.

They were Federal/Lake City production, definitely annealed. (Commercial loaded rounds are tumbled to polish case and it removes/hided the heat treatment (annealing) discoloring.

Pull several rounds, carefully weighing powder charges for determining consistency.

Or give all of then to me for testing purposes.

[NMRMN]

Pull several rounds, carefully weighing powder charges for determining consistency.

Or give all of then to me for testing purposes.

Haha. Thanks for the tip, and your offer

Any reference on the load data I should look for as well as consistency? I have no experience reloading, but the concept of checking the load weight does not seem overly complex.

[Hoot]

Pull several rounds, carefully weighing powder charges for determining consistency.

Or give all of then to me for testing purposes.

Haha. Thanks for the tip, and your offer

Any reference on the load data I should look for as well as consistency? I have no experience reloading, but the concept of checking the load weight does not seem overly complex.

Everything you observed is consistent with re-manufactured, de-milled military surplus ammunition. Safe as mothers milk.

Shoot it and enjoy.

Hoot

[OldmanFCSA]

Pull several rounds, carefully weighing powder charges for determining consistency.

Or give all of then to me for testing purposes.

Haha. Thanks for the tip, and your offer

Any reference on the load data I should look for as well as consistency? I have no experience reloading, but the concept of checking the load weight does not seem overly complex.

NO - if your are not an experienced reloader, skip this test. Some of us with vast experience (old age) may be able to determine the powder type and charge, but if military loaded, they use powders that are usually not available to reloaders.

[rtwills]

I just opened up a box of ss109's I have , HS is FC 12. all primers are silver with blue color sealant on them , my 855's have a bronze color primer with purple sealant on the primers