Big trouble with the Precision Delta group buy

[LePetomane]

.

[BigDog58]

First off, no I was not there. I moved the date to the 14th. A relative has offered to pay the membership fee of $190 as a gift but I haven't yet decided whether or not I'm going to accept it. They know I was unable to join lat year because of my health at the time and put my name on the list and waited a year to be drawn.

I have been silent, because I've been restricted by the moderators as to what I can say. I asked one, cobb for a clarification and attempted to explain some things. In so many words I was told to SHOVE It and it was my mess to clean up. I've never once denied this. Many days ago I posted asking that All involved email me directly with the information I need to assure my records of each person is correct. As of today,I gave received exactly three (3).

It appears that Sam is the one with the biggest mouth yet as of 8:28pm 3/15/14 he had not bothered to send me his information. Nothing, NADA not a damn thing. Sam has a lot of blowhard stuff to say about me and how "concerned" he is but obviously he isn't THAT concerned! Sam, youhgave my email address and my home and cell number, grow a set and do what you need to do. By the way, you are LAST on the list, and IF I have an address for you, sent by you, you will get every penny after everyone else that paid before you is repaid.

A lot of people not involved have had a lot to say, both good and bad. My reputation on this forum is gone forever and I can accept that. I'm taking responsibility for what had occurred, and gave already begun taking care of the problem to the best of my ability. If that isn't fast enough for some of you, I'm sorry, but it is what it is. The only reason I'm still on this forum is to try and assure I can stay in touch with who I owe, no more, no less. There are other forums beside GunTalk. I survived 53 yrs without it and I'll survive another few at least. I have made a few really good friends in this forum and they, unlike Sam, have emailed me. So far, with encouraging words. For them, I'm thankful. While I used to think Sam was just full of B.S. and like to hide behind his keyboard and be a bully, now I'm convinced of it. The proof is here!

There are accusations I wanted to hire a guide to go hunting. I would love to, as I hunted Russian Boar in the Fla Everglades in my youth, with nothing more than two dogs and a knife. Not many can say that and I cherish those days and long lovingly for them again, though I know they will never be again. It was nice hearing from Spartan, but he understood I could not financially do it now. I will in the future. You see, I lost EVERYTHING I owned April 3rd, 2009 when my house burned down and two neighbors, literally drug me out the back door saving my life after I had fallen and broken my good leg trying to get out, while thankfully I was home alone. So whatever you have to throw at me, is fine. If it makes you feel better, do it! I'm strong enough to take it.

I posted I was going to Ahlmans, that was true. I had to take my sick neighbors mother home to Southern MN so she could see her heart doctor, she's 84. I ended up not stopping at Ahlmans as I had no money to.spend. I only offered in an attempt to save someone gas money if they happened to need something while I was down that way.

I also posted that I bought 1lb of R-19 powder, this is true. I spent $27 and of that I'm guilty. I needed to load some ammo for a friend and he bought the pound, so I could load some ammo for him, and I get to keep what's left.

It was mentioned I load ammo for other people. Frankly it's NONE of ANYONE here's business. But yes, I load some ammo for family and some friends both here and in another state. They pay for the supplies, I enjoy my hobby. I've loaded ammo for several people on this board and all of them are happy. Some was even used in competitions. I guess Sam will belittle me for this, but I wonder how he'll feel when he knows I loaded EVERY round of 50BMG (yeah Sam that's a REAL EFFEN gun and maybe someday you will step up to) , that OldmanFCSA shot in Alliance,NE when we went last June, and every round I shot, he loaded for me. I trust the man with my life and he showed me he trusted his life in me! I don't take that lightly.

Lastly, today I went to the Wells Gunshow with OldmanFCSA after he asked me to ride with him. I had a great time and made a few new friends. At least one, knew how full of bravado Sam is with his keyboard. Sam, you truly are a mental midget. Just in case anyone needs to know,I spent five bucks to get in and a buck on a Pepsi Oh, I also spent $26 on some 6mm bullets i'll get rfunded for. I'm guessing this post might not be left up on the board because it's the truth. If it is, I'll need surprised. It might possibly get me banned permanently before I can get all the contact info I need. If so, so be it. I have not been silent because I'm afraid. More because I don't enjoy sharing ALL of my life on a simple forum with many people I don't know. I know I should gave said something sooner but until two weeks ago I thought I had it under control but that money feel thru. I NEVER told PD to "hold" any order, I only instructed them to call me before they charged the card to allow me to call my bank and have the daily charge limit they have on debit cards raised high enough to cover the charge, in order to prevent a bounce .I have been calling them every two weeks since Dec. 26th trying to find out the status of order. It has been stated, on here was "on hold" (I'm delivering part of a member's PD bullets to tomorrow, he will see copies of the orders). and at one point they could not even find my order. From what I could hear over the phone, they don't even use computer records. They were digging through paper orders looking for mine. They finally found it last Monday. Unfortunately, the person that was going to loan me the money to cover the order, was recently laid off and could no longer allow me to use her credit card. She is my relative and is 73. If I were able to go back to work tomorrow,I would start looking for employment today. I'm not, I'm permanently medically retired with a disability income based on my income in 2003 and it will NEVER go up. When SSI gets a raise, they lower the disability an equal amount.

I am NOT selling the few assets (guns. , 3 rifles all over 20 yrs old one will be 42 in May, a 22lr given to me on my 14th birthday by my late parents, and 3 pistols), they would not much help the issue. Sam, do some more checking, numerous people got their bullets from the first two shipments. Tomorrow, another member is getting part of his shipment that I was trying to hold until the entire shipment in to prevent a nightmare in record keeping. He will also see copies of the original orders, placed April 30,2013 & May 22, 2013. When you talk to PD remember, these are the same people that originally PROMISED they would ship within 12-13 weeks and after 19 ( Sept) they kept telling me they had no idea about when they would ship, denied telling me 12-13 weeks and then asked me to NOT call them as often.

If this post gets deleted by the mods, I won't be surprised. If I'm banned, you know how to contact me everyone.

BigDog58@gmail.com

Jim

PS: I'm sorry I couldn't post more but my cell phone battery is dying.

[LePetomane]

There is more BS in this thread than in a Kansas City feedlot!!!!!!!!

[MaryB]

typing with a wrist brace = typoes lol kicking

I also do not believe in licking someone when they are down

100% of puppies surveyed disagree with you.

[cobb]

For those that have a financial interest in this, please understand why this thread may be locked or why a problem may be dealt with by banning an individual that continues to blame other for his dishonesty.
If this thread gets locked, info deleted by a party or the problem individual gets banned, please start another informational thread in the Market Place group buy area to discuss your options.
Link here - viewtopic.php?f=27&t=47728
There have been some comments as to why this forum has allowed the airing of dirty laundry or something close to that. This was a group buy that was initiated and promoted by a member on this forum. That members evidently did not follow through with the forum group buy for one reason or another, has funds from forum members and has been less than honest with the status of those funds or merchandise and the ability to refund. So there is no airing of dirty laundry, but a conversation and posting of information that involves the purchase of a product by forum members through another forum member that has apparently misrepresented his group buy and is less than honorable in explaining why.
So if BigDog is banned because of his less than honest posting here, please understand why and pursues the steps needed to recoup your losses.

BigDog has provided this e-mail
BigDog58@gmail.com
Hopefully this is an honest effort by him to provide contact for information for those that have questions as to where they are in the PD group buy.

[Evad]

Tomorrow, another member is getting part of his shipment that I was trying to hold until the entire shipment in to prevent a nightmare in record keeping. He will also see copies of the original orders, placed April 30,2013 & May 22, 2013.

For the record. I am the member mentioned above. I emailed Jim with all details when this thread popped up and he came in and asked for contact info, etc. After a couple emails, he called me tonight to confirm tomorrow. I am pretty sure I have more skin in this than anyone, so I will be happy to see some resolution. Jim has my partial order, and is also taking something out of his reloading inventory to cover part of the rest (not what I ordered, but something that will be satisfactory to me). I do have an email from him about the partial order from before his surgery, but I wasn't in a hurry and wanted the whole thing or I would have had it by now. After tomorrow's exchange I will be in the neighborhood others are in financially. So, take it for what you will...but I will feel comforted seeing him doing what he is saying. Thankfully, I spent nothing I couldn't afford to go without for a while, I put food and bills first. I hope you are all in the same boat.

Should something go wrong, I will update. When it goes as planned, I will update. I have to doubt anything will go wrong at this point.

[BigDog58]

To ALL Involved in the Precision Precision Delta Group Buys. This will be my LAST post on this thread. If you want to contct me you have the means and the directions are posted under Precision Delta Group Buy in Market Place. I suggest if you want your refund, stop whining and get your information to me as soon as is possible. I will reply with an acknowledgement of receipt of your email within 24-36 hrs. If you have received the acknowledgement please resend so it will make it easier for me to locate if it goes to my spam folder (I'm trying to correct that tonight, but I can assure it won't happen at least a few more times). I do check it at least twice a day but I get hundreds in my spam folder and I don't wish to miss it

Since legal action has been discussed here, I have been instructed to digitally copy ANY and ALL posts in regards to this where my full name has been mentioned. All pages, both posted and PM'd have been digitally copied and all IP information has been garnered from the server files as have some other pertinent PM's as may possibly be needed for sustaining a "slander or destruction of charachter" case my legal councel see's necessary.

As of 12:45am 3/9/2014 not ONE SINGLE Person has lost ONE Penny. What and how I conduct my finances are no one's business until you have actually sustained a finacial loss! I am making efforts to return each affected persons money. I have never said it will be fast, but progress has and is being made. Every person directly involved in the Group buys have my email address as well as my home phone number, it was given to each of you when you where sent the info on what you owed and where to send the funds. Certainly if I would have had any intention of defrauding anyone, you all would not have received my home, number and address as well as my email address.
After this post, you may contact me directly as I have described or through the Market Place section related solely to Precision Delta Buys, unless I am banned from that section as well.

I wish most of you well. I highly suggest you desist personal attacks except as is in regards to funds owed you. Please don't take this lightly, both you, and this forum may be held accountable and liable. All traffic related to this issue is on a continuous dump, that cannot and will not be stopped until this issue is settled to it's fullest.

[mrp]

[ttousi]

I have been silent, because I've been restricted by the moderators as to what I can say.

FALSE

He was restricted to posting in two threads this being one, with no content restrictions.

[Erud]

Since legal action has been discussed here, I have been instructed to digitally copy ANY and ALL posts in regards to this where my full name has been mentioned. All pages, both posted and PM'd have been digitally copied and all IP information has been garnered from the server files as have some other pertinent PM's as may possibly be needed for sustaining a "slander or destruction of charachter" case my legal councel see's necessary.

"Legal Counsel" tends to have all kinds of stupid ideas like this, it's how they make a living. Just remember though, even after you lose the internet "slander or destruction of character" case, you will still get a big bill for his time spent on it.

[mmcnx2]

Mod's dump this if it over the line..but

Guy A gives Guy B money for Product C to be delivered at a future date.
This transaction is facilitated in public venue.
Future data comes and goes a few times.
Guy A is concerned for his investment and inquires to Guy B.
This inquiry is facilitated in the same public venue.
Guy A does not get a response or an acceptable response.
Guy A steps up the inquiries.
These inquiries are facilitated in the same public venue.
Guy B makes a public appeal for understanding.
This appeal is made the same public venue.
Guy A, D, E and others chime in that the whole deals stinks.
They chime in on the same public venue.
Guy B says his attorney tells him to shut up.

So a few observations...

Guy A is screwed.
Guy D, E and others got free tickets to an ugly divorce(think reality TV), and like all public splits, folks take sides.
Guy B is a tool, he has Guy's A money and he is the one calling a lawyer.
Guy A is screwed again, this time everyone gets to watch.

Thus ended the lesson of the day.

[JJ]

And some of friends wonder why I laugh hysterically when they talk about doing group buys.

To the people that BigDink has screwed, I feel for ya guys.

[CarRacer]

Jim has $214 of my money and I think it is the height of stupidity that he wants me to do *anything* more to get it back. This is his fault, I shouldn't have to email or call to get back what is mine. One of the main reasons I bought into his whole nightmare was because he had his paperwork together and seemed really organized.

As far as I see it, this is just Jim putting another road block between us and our money. Shameful.

[Seismic Sam]

Well, I'll just ignore all the personal attacks by Jim, because they mean nothing to me. I was going to tell everybody that Jim did not show for his training, but now his own post mentions there might be a "gift" from a relative of $190 so he can join on the 14th. A "gift" from a relative?? Really?? And that makes the fundamental situation different how? Dunno what else I can say. I would LOVE to hear from more people who got bullets from Jim, but after several weeks of this the only two who got bullets and told me about it are Rodentman and Slurpy. I don't know what I'll do if I suddenly get calls from other people who aren't members of this forum but swear they got bullets from Jim.

Car Racer makes a really good point about contact information, and his post says it all, so I won't repeat it. What I plan to do in the near future is create a spreadsheet of people from all 3 buckets with their board names attached, the amount of money they lost and the bullets they ordered. The total looks to line up with more or less with PD's list of what Jim placed on hold. Past that, I'm not sure what further contribution I can make. The two outstanding matters that I will note is that PD has searched high and low, and cannot find any previous order from Jim or to Jim's address. if Jim wants to post the invoice that he got with the bullets from GB1 as proof of what he got and that he ordered it, I'm sure that would be helpful to everyone, and conversely, I think we all know what Jim's continued silence will mean. The second issue is that no one has signed in who had bullets in either order but backed out without finding a replacement buyer. Two people did back out of GB1 (I assume it's GB1), but they handed their order off to another board member. As such, there's no evidence I can find that Jim ever got left holding the bag in any way. If he wants to name names of people who did leave him hanging, I'm sure that would also be helpful to us, but again the converse will be true if all we get is silence. That's about it, and as I stated at the beginning I stepped in because the guy who found all this out after fighting for two full months to get it only has 125 posts, and the first time me mentioned the possibility of trouble people jumped on him. As a charter member of this board, I decided to take the responsibility to look into this fustercluck knowing full well that it was going to be a disgusting, ugly job, but I took it on anyway. I wanted answers just like the rest of you did, and I wanted them ASAP, and I figured that the only way that was going to happen was to use the helping hand at the end of my own arm.

[xd ED]

Since legal action has been discussed here, I have been instructed to digitally copy ANY and ALL posts in regards to this where my full name has been mentioned. All pages, both posted and PM'd have been digitally copied and all IP information has been garnered from the server files as have some other pertinent PM's as may possibly be needed for sustaining a "slander or destruction of charachter" case my legal councel see's necessary.

"Legal Counsel" tends to have all kinds of stupid ideas like this, it's how they make a living. Just remember though, even after you lose the internet "slander or destruction of character" case, you will still get a big bill for his time spent on it.

And using internet postings where one has essentially admitted deceiving a group of people involving a large sum of money, as a basis for a civil action might conceviably backfire if said records were then used as evidence in any criminal fraud case, which if conviction and judgement were attained, would likely end with a court ordered forfeiture/ liquidation of assets to satisfy the damaged parties.
And while IANAL, I do know that when you're deep in a hole, it's best to stop digging.