Recommend a Lab/Retriever breeder?

[EJSG19]

Well that was more than I had planned to write....

Even so, thank you for taking the time to post that. These are the types of things I enjoy researching, and can talk about for hours, as I detect you can to.

I blame Belgiboy for getting me interested in bird hunting in Minnesota. My land is in Iowa, and now it takes a non-resident license to hunt there the way I understand it. If I had a dog though, the cost of that NR license wouldn't matter. Plus my Dad would really like it with a dog I'm sure.

Short term training like that I might consider, but I hate to send a dog away for months on end. I do know that I would not be as effective of a trainer as a full-time trainer, just have to decide on the committment. I've had dogs that I worked with on my own, and they worked well in the field, but not great. 95% of that problem is that I haven't learned enough, and as a kid, didn't take the time to train them more. Its been about 10 years now since I've had a dog, so the thought is appealing.

[1911fan]

I have some friends who are serious into the dog part of hunting, I will ask, they have several types they work with.

with all the breeding etc that goes into it, the best hunting dog I ever shot over was a German shorthair/lab mix of impeccable parents who decided to hook up on a family vacation, The cross seemed to bring out only the best and the dog was amazing.

[EJSG19]

I have some friends who are serious into the dog part of hunting, I will ask, they have several types they work with.

with all the breeding etc that goes into it, the best hunting dog I ever shot over was a German shorthair/lab mix of impeccable parents who decided to hook up on a family vacation, The cross seemed to bring out only the best and the dog was amazing.

Cool, I'd appreciate hearing what they had to say on it.

For me, getting to watch a dog who know's what he's doing is almost better than getting birds. A truly good bird dog does not come along very often. If any of you have one, you have my admiration. The next trouble is, the good ones just don't live long enough.

[lenny7]

My land is in Iowa, and now it takes a non-resident license to hunt there the way I understand it. If I had a dog though, the cost of that NR license wouldn't matter. Plus my Dad would really like it with a dog I'm sure.

There's an easier ways to hunt with a dog down there...just invite me

Hunting with a good dog is on a whole 'nother level than hunting without. I can't believe I waited so long. Last year was incredible. Not only did I get to hunt with my first dog, but my 11 year old boy (10 then) hunted with me for the first time. Watching those two in the field is a pure joy.

Short term training like that I might consider, but I hate to send a dog away for months on end. I do know that I would not be as effective of a trainer as a full-time trainer, just have to decide on the committment. I've had dogs that I worked with on my own, and they worked well in the field, but not great. 95% of that problem is that I haven't learned enough, and as a kid, didn't take the time to train them more. Its been about 10 years now since I've had a dog, so the thought is appealing.

It does suck. Ours was gone for 10 weeks. I worked with him every day so he was a solid gundog going out, but I was amazed at the difference. I plan on doing the remaining training myself though.

Some titles to check into for learning how to train:

Sound Beginnings DVD by Jackie Mertens (I actually have a copy I plan on selling)

The 10 Minute Retriever by John Dahl

Tom Dokken also has a new book out that I might get.

Lots of folks swear by the Wolters books. I tried to read one and while it was enjoyable reading, I preferred other books.

Another puppy training book to check into is My Smart Puppy by Sarah Wilson. It's actually an annoying read...I think its intended audience is those that treat their dogs like their babies, but it actually has some excellent training "games" that both teach your puppy while asserting our dominance in a non-agressive, non-threatening way.

[lenny7]

One more thing (for now). Make sure you consider the total costs of dog ownership. My dog only cost $350, but I put out over $2000 in the first year, not counting training. Normal expenses were compounded by a sudden introduction between the dog and a barbed wire fence that tore him open, and by a nasty foreign body puncturing and embedding in the webbing of his paw.

[EJSG19]

One more thing (for now). Make sure you consider the total costs of dog ownership. My dog only cost $350, but I put out over $2000 in the first year, not counting training. Normal expenses were compounded by a sudden introduction between the dog and a barbed wire fence that tore him open, and by a nasty foreign body puncturing and embedding in the webbing of his paw.

Thats one obstacle I'm worried about. The timeframe for training a bird dog at the right time is pretty well defined. Also, it'll be an inside/outside family dog as well, so at some point along the line, it won't be a dedicated bird dog all year long. So I'm wondering just how far to take the training, with that in mind.

Also, I may be the only one wanting to spend money on training, as that is just another thing to blow money on. Hmm, time to start selling the appeal of upland hunting to those other lovely people who reside in my house

[justaguy]

My dog is a Danikk and Dr. Smith was my vet for awhile. She is a good person to talk to about your concerns. She has a lot of info and is helpful. She will also recommend other vets in your area if you prefer. To have a well trained dog takes a lot of time and dedication. Like Lenny said they also cost money to maintain, and you need to plan ahead. Do you have a truck/SUV, who will watch it if you travel, how much do you like your yard. You are doing your research so you should have a little bit of a clue. If you need a kennel let me know I have one I could probably part with on the cheap.

http://www.microchipidsystems.com/
Dr Smith knew someone that was hunting out of state with their dog and lost the dog without a collar. The dog was picked up over a mile away, and the chip was the only way thy were able to find the owner.

If/when you get the dog get it on a Friday you wont sleep the first night or so. They cry all night the first night away from the litter.

[Belgiboy]

I blame Belgiboy for getting me interested in bird hunting in Minnesota.

You are welcome, I've been blamed for far worse things than that

Don't rule out the German shorthaired pointer if you're looking for an upland hunting dog that is a great family dog too. My brother-in-law had one and they are relentless, they simply keep going, putting ol' Fiasco (my chocolate lab) to shame. If you're willing to put in a bit of time there is no reason why you couldn't train your own gundog. There is excellent literature available and a short drive south of the cities is the Louisville swamp WMA where you can work out with your puppy as much as you want. There's a fair number of pheasants there but more bunnies, squirrels and coyote.

[lenny7]

Thats one obstacle I'm worried about. The timeframe for training a bird dog at the right time is pretty well defined.

I'm not sure what you mean by that. Socialization has a certain time frame and is VERY important, but the timing on the bird dog training isn't so critical (in spite of what Wolters preaches). Just my opinion from my research, certainly not from experience.

Also, it'll be an inside/outside family dog as well, so at some point along the line, it won't be a dedicated bird dog all year long. So I'm wondering just how far to take the training, with that in mind.

Some say that dogs perform better in the field if their kept inside because they form a stronger bond with the owner. Others say that's BS. I don't think it matters all that much. Our dog is first and foremost a family pet. We keep him inside. He is not allowed on beds, furniture or upstairs and we have not caught him trying do do any of that in about a year. The key is consistent OB training. Bird dog training really isn't affected by whether it's an indoor or outdoor dog.

Also, I may be the only one wanting to spend money on training, as that is just another thing to blow money on. Hmm, time to start selling the appeal of upland hunting to those other lovely people who reside in my house

Any kids? I used that as my argument for spending the money. The boy is just starting hunting and a good dog makes the experience just that much better. You could get 10 great years out of the dog so divide the cost by 10 for the yearly cost. I don't know if my wife bought any of it, but she did let me go ahead with it. I did offer to make it my father's day, birthday, and Christmas presents for the next 5 years.

[1911fan]

If you get a good trainer, and there are many, a lot of them are tied in with a Vet who works stuff out with customers of the trainer. I have access to a vet who has given me a grab bag of stuff to treat the minor and major stuff should I need it, as well as stuff like a sterile stapler and some meds to carry on trips. if you get lucky, you get something like this

[lenny7]

Don't rule out the German shorthaired pointer if you're looking for an upland hunting dog that is a great family dog too.

That was my number one choice until a great opportunity on a very well bred lab fell into my lap.

[justaguy]

Also, I may be the only one wanting to spend money on training, as that is just another thing to blow money on. Hmm, time to start selling the appeal of upland hunting to those other lovely people who reside in my house

Get your significant other around well trained dogs, and stay away from the untrained ones. My SO did not want a dog, she thought all dogs were a pain in the ass that jumped up on people, ran away when you opened the door, pulled you down the side walk on a leash, growled when you messed with it while they ate, were smelly and dirty. After I a conversation about training and some reading she agreed. Now she just thinks he is a cute bum that likes to sleep, eat, and walk. Ask the SO about what she doesn't like and train the dog not to do the things she doesn't like.

If you dont have to have a puppy rescues are a good deal.

[mmcnx2]

A few thoughts form a guy that has two purebreed brittanys.

You definitely want a purebreed, while it does not guarantee the dog will be a fantastic hunter it does improve the odds.

Second, find the local breeders association for the breed your interested in they can be very helpful in locating quality breeders. Understand there will be breeders for different groups, a show ring dog verses a field trial dog will have very very different attributes. A good field trial breeder should be able to show you both the male and female work so you at least know what the possible outcome can be. Picking a good breeder I think is the hardest and most important step, there are alot of guys pouring puppies out and very few really bettering the breed, which is what they are suppose to do.

Third, talk to the local game farms some have associations with breeders other just know who has good dogs.

Think about training needed to get the dog to work like you want, if you know you can handle it go ahead, if not consider a started or finished dog. Both of mine I bought finished, I don't' know enough about training pointers to get the results I want, but I was smart enough to find someone that was outstanding at training and let them do their job.

Get the dog chipped, most vets will scan all new dogs they see and if you should ever loose the dog or have it stolen this will red flag it within minutes of the scan. My vet actually called the breeder to confirm the purchase and chip transfer becuase the breeder chips all his dogs before delivery.

[lenny7]

I've heard, anecdotally, that another way to get a good dog cheap is to go out to the animal shelters in South Dakota about 2 or 3 weeks after pheasant season opens and see what's available. I"m not sure if it's true or not.

[mattxd]

For me, getting to watch a dog who know's what he's doing is almost better than getting birds. A truly good bird dog does not come along very often. If any of you have one, you have my admiration. The next trouble is, the good ones just don't live long enough.

you said it, my last lab was 15 and that wasn't long enough. She was able to hunt until she was 12 but I had to be very careful about heat and only one morning per week. My next dog will probably be from Lund kennels a few friends back in SD have dogs from there. Good hunter I know of a couple form there are local drug dogs.
http://www.pointinglabslund.com/index.htm