Del-Tone Closed. ?????

[thompssj]

I guess a Mini 2 gun will not happen this month. http://www.del-tone-luth.com/

[Pat Cannon]

Wow, that is a load of steaming government crap.

[ttousi]

Those folks need to have legal counsel and use the Range Protection Act of 05. It's intent is to stop this nonsense. The only way they can shut down a range is for a safety violation and must be given the opportunity to correct.....IIRC

IANAL

range_law_q&a.pdf

(75.96 KB) Downloaded 215 times

[ttousi]

full statute

http://law.justia.com/minnesota/codes/85/85-87a.html

I will locate the name of the attorney OGC discussed CUP issues with and report back. The guy has been thru it before and knows his stuff

[FJ540]

If rifles are allowed, why on earth would hand guns be prohibited??

I fail to see the issue - rifle is obviously far more dangerous (range wise) and intrusive (noise), so why would pistol be a violation?

[1911fan]

If rifles are allowed, why on earth would hand guns be prohibited??

I fail to see the issue - rifle is obviously far more dangerous (range wise) and intrusive (noise), so why would pistol be a violation?

Its politics, the wording on the CUL was poorly done, and unfortunately, Deltone accepted it as issued,

[rugersol]

This is focused on two main points ... "handguns" ... and "rapid-fire".

It's easy to point your finger at the VPC or the Brady Bunch. But I know all too well, so-called "firearms enthusiasts" are also to blame.

I've personally been scolded for practicing my "Gunfighter" for SASS ... at 3 different ranges ... and for "rapid-fire" at Bill's North just this last Fall.

Guns make people nervous. They make people who don't own guns, VERY nervous ... regardless of how they vote, in November.

But shooting FAST, or with a gun in each hand, makes a lotta fellow NRA members nervous, too. Even worse, a lotta these guys are self-proclaimed "firearms experts". They think, just because they "say" it's "too dangerous", it is.

Just horses of a different color.

Not a lotta point in runnin' matches where the name of the game is "beat the clock", when "rapid-fire" ain't allowed.

It's just like AR's. Dumbo wasn't alone. Somehow, AR's came out on top, there. So now, "handguns", and "rapid-fire" are the new "evil" ... well ... they've always been "evil" ... but we've done a good job of keeping it our dirty little secret ... until now.

SASS, USPSA, IDPA, and 3-gun are among the most popular shooting sports in the country. Private property aside, who knows of a range in MN that supports shooting two handguns as fast as you can?

I'd like to think that new show on Spike is gonna bring a lot more people "around". But then again, we might jest be gettin' a whole lotta new "experts".

[Erik_Pakieser]

While I agree with ahrens and think he makes a very valid point about other gun owners, the issue for DelTon is their CUP, not the actions of other shooters.

I hope that Randy can resolve this with the County. While I believe the Range Protection law may be of some use, IANAL and I am not sure how that works when a CUP is also in play.

Best of luck!

[Keith]

For what it's worth, only the rifle ranges will be closed. The shotgun ranges are still open and I'm sure they would appreciate business. Trap. Skeet. 5 stand and a very nice walk through sporting clays course are all open for business as usual. Randy was able to get a cease and desist order so we could shoot the Ruger Rimfire Challenge last Saturday with the rifles.

As of right now the Tri-gun Challenge has been cancelled (sticking many folks with airfare) but there is still some chatter about doing it shotgun only to some degree. (doubtfull) The same could be done for the monthly shoots till this is all sorted out one way or the other.

[thompssj]

So Keith,
Is there gong to be a Mini 1 gun then, maybe, this Sunday??

[Keith]

So Keith,
Is there gong to be a Mini 1 gun then, maybe, this Sunday??

That would be nice but I don't know if they would try for this weekend. It wouldn't be much notice to shooters, either. Area 3 is this weekend so several shooters will be in Nebraska anyway. But, you never know. I think they have their hands full thinking about everything else.


Just got an e-mail from Bob saying they will probably make a decision today on whether or not to hold the big match as a shotgun only match.

[DeanC]

"Range Closure" Del-Tone /Luth Gun Range July 30, 2010

Fellow Shooters:

As many of you know,shooting range and firearms owners face ongoing battles regarding the exercise of our constitutional rights. Del-tone/Luth Gun Club recently found itself in the middle of one of these battles. For more than 30 years our gun club has been the site of a shooting range where rifles and handguns have been used by many. However, recently we have come under attack for allowing the use of handguns on our range. Sherburne County has served us with a lawsuit alledging that handgun use is not permitted at Del-tone.

I would like to bring you up to date on the issue of shooting Handguns at Del-Tone. The County initiated a demand letter dated June 7, which indicates that we are in violation of a Conditional Use Permit that was issued in 1995 for a Trap Range & Rifle Range, even though all types of firearms have been shot at the range prior to 1995.

I than called the County and asked for a meeting which was granted on June 21st. At that meeting I was served a summons by the Sheriffs Office that initiates a law suit against Del-tone for violation of the CUP for shooting handguns.

The law suit is on the back burner to see if we can work out the issue, however, at this time we must cease shooting handguns, which did occur on June 8th.
Initially I was hoping to resolve the CUP issue without legal counsel, however when I was served the summons for violating the CUP (Rifle Range vs. Shooting Range (handguns)), I noticed in the summons that the County Attorney also included a violation of allowing "rapid fire weapons" which I have no clue what a "rapid fire weapon" is? With this additional restriction of "rapid fire weapons" included in the summons, I decided to hire legal counsel.

Basically what has happened is the Sherburne County Attorneys’ office has filed a law suit against the club/range for shooting handguns because the 1995 CUP was submitted as a Rifle range. Obviously handguns have been shot at this gun club for over 30 years with no issues, as it pertains to rapid fire weapons, we do not allow rapid fire shooting on the gun ranges as a good neighbor gesture to the few homes in the surrounding area. If in fact the County is referring to "select fire weapons" such as machine guns or full auto firearms, we have a policy that full auto is not allowed for business reasons and not because it violates any state, federal or local zoning restrictions.

In the meantime we continue to lose income from the loss of CCW classes, the loss of Cowboy Action Shooting (SASS), the loss of daily handgun shooters, the loss of law enforcement shooters who need to remain proficient, the loss of 3 gun events, etc.

As we were preparing to address the handgun issue, on July 21st we were notified by the Zoning Department that the rifle range is not technically located on the proper plat that the 1994 conditional use permit was applied for. Obviously the previous owners built the rifle/gun ranges on the west side of the fence line that separated the family’s property. However over the years the legal description does not match the fence line.
The County now has demanded that the entire Rifle Range be closed until we apply for an amended CUP or a New CUP.

To argue our point, we will meet with the Board of Adjustments on Aug 12 at 6:00 PM to prove that the Rifle/Gun Range has been on the same location since the early 70’s and that it should be grandfathered in and for other technical reasons. This meeting will be held at:
Government Center in Elk River
13880 Hwy 10 Business Center Dr.
Elk River, MN 55330

Regardless of that outcome we will go before the Haven Township Board on Aug. 16th at 7:00 PM to amend our CUP to include all types of firearms including handguns and to include the correct plat that the rifle range now sits on. This meeting will be held at:
Haven Township Hall:: 4230 45th Avenue SE, St Cloud, MN 56304 http://haventwpmn.govoffice2.com/

On Aug 19th at 6:30 we must also meet with the Sherburne County Planning Commission at the:
Government Center in Elk River
13880 Hwy 10 Business Center Dr.
Elk River, MN 55330

I appreciate all the support and patience from our friends, members, & customers, and you can rest assured that we will fight this case diligently.
It is our intention and always has been to provide a safe range as well as a responsible range. The last thing we want or any of our shooters want is a round to leave the range or to allow irresponsible practices or policies.

We hope that you will be able to attend these meetings and we would ask that all pro-range supporters wear a RED or BLACK shirt, we would also ask that all shooteres act professionally.

Sincerely,
Randy E. Luth
Owner
Del-Tone/Luth Gun Range
Luth Unlimited LLC
http://www.del-tone-luth.com/

[Rip Van Winkle]

An article in the St. Cloud Times sheds some light on the ranges troubles.

http://www.sctimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=2010108200014

It doesn't look good for them IMHO.

[ttousi]

2nd hand info from an OGC member at the meeting last night........

They made it thru the planning commission meeting last night. They got approval on their plan to correct issues. Now it goes to the council. The range protection act has given them some leverage.

FWIW

[mmcnx2]

I like Del tone and the folks that run it, but the they are in this situtation becuase they got sloopy on the paperwork. I wish them the best. Just another reason to have competent legal council before you need it.