Recommended shooting instructor

[jshuberg]

phorvick and I have a class we teach over the course of a weekend. Includes holster work as well as shooting against a timer.

Link?

[farmerj]

phorvick and I have a class we teach over the course of a weekend. Includes holster work as well as shooting against a timer.

Link?

http://shootingsafely.com/7701.html

[jshuberg]

http://shootingsafely.com/7701.html

Cool, thanks!

[jshuberg]

edit: whomever's teaching this, please explain, this is NOT appropriate on a "common" firing line ... I'm getting tired getting covered 'cause guys can't figure out how to do this, AND keep the muzzle pointed downrange, at the same time

What's not appropriate?

[farmerj]

http://shootingsafely.com/7701.html

Cool, thanks!

I added links to some of the COF that I listed previously.

[farmerj]

edit: whomever's teaching this, please explain, this is NOT appropriate on a "common" firing line ... I'm getting tired getting covered 'cause guys can't figure out how to do this, AND keep the muzzle pointed downrange, at the same time

What's not appropriate?

Some folks draw BEFORE doing the pivot and as such, sweep the entire range and firing line BEFORE they should.

[jshuberg]

Some folks draw BEFORE doing the pivot and as such, sweep the entire range and firing line BEFORE they should.

Yes, I can see that would be a problem This is another reason proper training is essential.

Tactical class is held in the training bay, with doors locked, away from everyone else on the lanes. Proper muzzle discipline is *always* observed.
People should never do this in a public setting!

[rugersol]

edit: whomever's teaching this, please explain, this is NOT appropriate on a "common" firing line ... I'm getting tired getting covered 'cause guys can't figure out how to do this, AND keep the muzzle pointed downrange, at the same time

What's not appropriate?

They're on a "common" firing line ... other shooters alongside 'em ... they hold the grip in their strong-hand (finger may 'er may not be inside the trigger-guard) ... they turn the pistol sideways so it's pointing ALONG the "common" firing line, covering whomever may be there, and wrap their weak-hand over the top of the slide to manipulate it.

They should either pivot their body towards their strong-hand, so the same movement keeps the muzzle downrange ... or, better yet, focus on keeping the muzzle downrange, no matter what. I suspect keeping your feet mostly square, to downrange, and the muzzle pointed downrange, trying to wrap yer hand over the top of the slide may feel somewhat awkward. I don't really care how awkward it might feel. Pointing a gun at me is not acceptable!

I never used to see this sorta thing, at the range. Most newbs would keep their index finger mostly straight, and with the tip, and the thumb on the other side, release the slide like it was a steaming turd. I can only presume someone's teaching them this new technique. You mentioned it ... by the way you did, I guessed someone taught it to you. Sorry, if I was wrong.

[jshuberg]

Ah, I think my description of the overhand speed reload may have given the wrong impression. Here is a clarification:

When you run your gun dry, and are at slide lock, you should drop your empty mag, move the weapon into your workspace, and rotate it so that the barrel is pointed slightly up and left (if you are right handed). The muzzle, while canted at a slight angle, should still *always* be pointed downrange and in a safe direction. Visually acquire the mag well, and forcefully seat a new magazine into the weapon. Rotate the weapon forward again, and simultaneously move your support hand to an overhand grip on the slide "monkey style". With the weapon pointed forward, capture the rear sights with the meat of the palm and give the slide a firm tug rearward enough to disengage the slide lock (alternately, you could punch the weapon forward back to position 4). Reacquire your sight picture as you are moving your support hand into the support position.

My earlier point was that using the slingshot technique for racking the slide requires you to to correctly and exactly manipulate your fingers and obtain a solid purchase on the rear of the slide. Sweaty hands, rain, and plain old stress can make this extremely difficult to do. Using an overhand technique you do not use your fingers at all, and so will maximize your ability to perform a speed reload correctly in an adverse situation. No matter how you disengage the slide lock - manually via the controls, or by racking the slide (slingshot or overhand), the weapon should always be pointed forward, downrange, in a safe direction.

[rugersol]

Visually acquire the mag well, and forcefully seat a new magazine into the weapon. Rotate the weapon forward again

I think ya'll need to post a video ... but if yer looking at the mag-well opening, on a "common" firing line, I believe that gun's covering the line (unless you pivot yer body to yer strong side). Maybe I'm not understanding what you're saying by "Rotate the weapon forward again"?

Regardless, if someone's teaching people to wrap their hand over the slide, the tendency, fer most folks, is gonna be to turn the gun sideways. At least, that's what I'm seeing, at the range. Point being, when teaching such a thing, mentioning such a tendency, to raise awareness, at the very least, would be appreciated.

[jshuberg]

Understood

When I say visually acquire the mag well, I don't mean to actually look down into it, or even see the opening. I simply mean to look at the base of the grip where the mag well is, and mentally register it's location and orientation before seating the magazine. Many people try to slam the magazine home by feel alone, without actually looking at it. Or if they look at it, they don't actually 'see' it. If you make the point to actually see the location and angle of the mag well, and even pause for a fraction of a second right before seating the magazine, you are less likely to fumble with it. This is especially important with single stack magazines and/or smaller pistols.

Canting the weapon at a slight angle up and left as you visually acquire the mag well simply makes it easier to seat the magazine properly. Slight means slight - you might not be pointed directly at your target, but you should definitely still be pointing down range and away from the firing line. If you ever see anyone chambering a round while holding the weapon horizontally, you should either have words with them or notify the RSO that someone is being unsafe on the line.

[Don L]

Thanks for the kind words, everyone!

Don

[propilot777]

BANNED USER

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=26215&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=30#p334271

Don has some really great corses; I've taken a few of them. Midwest Carry Academy is pretty good as well but they only do upper level courses upon request so you have to email them to get more infor about it.

[craigom]

I realize this question has been asked & answered, but I have also had the pleasure of learning from Don Larson (Don L.). I'm sure that he has forgotten more about safe, accurate handgunning than most of us may ever know. If you are a new shooter, he's your guy. If you are an experienced shooter looking to better your IPSC/IDPA scores, he's your coach. If your spouse doesn't listen to you well, and may listen even less when she/he has a gun in hand, he's the guy to teach her/him. Why practice the same old bad habits and expect different results (think golf driving range)?

Give Don a shout on his website @ http://www.mncarrypermit.com or on this forum and he'll gladly "straighten you out"

Don!

[Bender]

Don has some really great corses; I've taken a few of them. Midwest Carry Academy is pretty good as well but they only do upper level courses upon request so you have to email them to get more infor about it.

Above post was reported.

propilot777 is Chris the owner of Midwest Carry... Banned.