Peace rally at State Capital and other ways to help.

[yukonjasper]

I hate to say it, but you guys need to quit posting Facebook references as if Facebook is totally ubiquitous. If its important, please do a screen shot or summarize what is on the page you are trying to direct people to.

Sorry to be a grump on that, but not only is it blocked on my work computer - I am not a member and don't plan to be, so it does me no good to see a facebook reference.

[tazdevil]

Thanks XD ED. So it is ok to carry on the grounds without notification. You just can't carry in any state building within the defined boundaries without notification. I am interpreting that correctly, right?

You're interpreting it the same as I do.

So unless you notify, No pee breaks inside the capitol building while carrying. Just a reminder, as sometimes people forget the basic functions of the human body can dictate some of what you do.

On another note, anyone hear if there will be anti-protesters there (Joan or Heather's clans, or other's)? I figure it's a possibility, and make sure to treat them with respect, regardless of how they are treating you. You will be the face planted all over the news if you react any other way, regardless of what the other side of the argument does.

[Greg]

Thanks XD ED. So it is ok to carry on the grounds without notification. You just can't carry in any state building within the defined boundaries without notification. I am interpreting that correctly, right?

You're interpreting it the same as I do.

So unless you notify, No pee breaks inside the capitol building while carrying. Just a reminder, as sometimes people forget the basic functions of the human body can dictate some of what you do.

On another note, anyone hear if there will be anti-protesters there (Joan or Heather's clans, or other's)? I figure it's a possibility, and make sure to treat them with respect, regardless of how they are treating you. You will be the face planted all over the news if you react any other way, regardless of what the other side of the argument does.

Be polite to Heather and her three followers!

[xd ED]

Thanks XD ED. So it is ok to carry on the grounds without notification. You just can't carry in any state building within the defined boundaries without notification. I am interpreting that correctly, right?

You're interpreting it the same as I do.

So unless you notify, No pee breaks inside the capitol building while carrying. Just a reminder, as sometimes people forget the basic functions of the human body can dictate some of what you do.

On another note, anyone hear if there will be anti-protesters there (Joan or Heather's clans, or other's)? I figure it's a possibility, and make sure to treat them with respect, regardless of how they are treating you. You will be the face planted all over the news if you react any other way, regardless of what the other side of the argument does.

The bathrooms are a concern. At larger rallies, there are port-poties to be found. Either disarm discretely, or head for Sears.

[jshuberg]

I just spoke with the capital police to make sure that my letter was still on file with them, which it was. I also asked them how they interpret the statute - is a letter required for just the capital buildings, or the capital grounds. Their official position is that you need to send notification if you plan to carry anywhere on the capital grounds.

I know that the wording of the statute indicates that notification is only needed when inside a capital building, but given that capital police interpret it differently, I would *highly* recommend sending a notification letter if you plan on attending any events at the capital, especially a pro 2A rally. Presuming the capital police are wrong, you're still likely to be cuffed and taken away if they find you carrying without notification. This would undoubtedly be filmed and reported all over the news media that armed protesters were arrested demonstrating at the capital. This would not help our cause.

I know that many may think that the capital police are interpreting the statute too broadly. That may be true, but this is not the time or place to challenge it. Only participate in one form of activism at a time so as not to confuse the issue. These events at the capital are for the purpose of demonstrating that average, normal, well balanced, law abiding citizens are standing up so their 2A rights not be infringed.

For those who feel the capital police are overreaching their authority, please put that feeling aside for the greater good and play ball with them by sending a notification letter. It takes almost no effort and only costs the amount of the postage.

Also, I seem to recall that parking ramps *are* considered buildings for the purpose of the statute, meaning that if you park in a ramp anywhere on the capital grounds without providing notification, you are breaking the law.

For those who have sent a notification letter in the past and want to check that they are still on file the number is 651-296-6741.

[adoptedson]

Thanks for the report jshuberg! Good to know.

[xd ED]

The 'whole grounds' interpretation was how I first had this explained to me. What I don't recall or understands is how this plays out regarding the public streets, and even private property within the area described.

[jshuberg]

To the best of my knowledge, there's never been a test case to answer these questions. Best thing to do is just send a notification letter and it'll never become an issue.

[Shako Sparky]

I just sent my letter, I hope it gets there in time.

[JohnGageMN]

To the best of my knowledge, there's never been a test case to answer these questions. Best thing to do is just send a notification letter and it'll never become an issue.

There doesn't need to be a test case, the statute is black and white. It specifically only deals with carry within buildings on the capitol grounds and then goes on to define what the boundaries of the capitol grounds are. There is not one place where it says, or even suggests, that carrying in the public open spaces is in any way restricted. The officer you spoke with was either ignorant of the law or was giving you a more restrictive answer to err on the side of caution.

I'm not discouraging anyone from sending in the proper notification for carry at the capitol so one can enter the various buildings for reasons of lobbying your reps, etc. I wish more people would do so and make use of it, heck, I wish I had the time to do so there more often. That said, we don't need inaccurate information about the MCPPA floating around out there amongst those of us who are the one who SHOULD have an understanding of the law.

While I appreciate your taking initiative to gain understanding of something, with all due respect to our friends in law enforcement, you don't go to a cop for legal advice, you go to a lawyer.

[plblark]

OK, I know I'll take some heat for this but IMnsHO this isn't a "I'v got a gun!" rally, it's a I OPPOSE GUN CONTROL Rally!

As such, I'd personally recomend CC for your defensive firearm. I like the open, empty, visible holster idea as a symbol. In My Not so humble opinion,

My opinion only.

I modified this from a past event. I'll try to pass on some guidelines from successful events and activists:

1) Only ONE type of activism at a time.
Decide WHICH TYPE of activism for WHICH cause and ruthlessly eliminate any linkage to ANY other cause or group.
This keeps your supporters, opposition, those on the sideline, and most importantly YOU from getting confused about your motives and goals.

2) Communicate clearly and effectively
In essence what you're trying to do here is to normalize gun ownership.

What is your message? - It's no big deal folks, we're regular people doing something lawful. DON'T PUNISH US FOR THE ACTS OF A MONSTER!
Try to remove anything that would distract from the message or allow the opposition or audience to get sidetracked. It's not enough to be RIGHT, you have to be able to communicate it in a manner that people will leave better informed or with a better opinion of your cause. Simple, concise, well documented, calmly presented, Normalized, safe, rational, non-threatening. The more common sense you can present it the better.

What is your target audience?
You have several different layers and levels of people who will be taking this in:
The general public: ARE WHIPPED UP BY THE MEDIA RIGHT NOW. They don't usually think about guns, generally believe the news and movies, are uncomfortable with people with guns. They often project their fears and motives onto you. Most of their experience with guns is incorrect or through examples of illegal behavior, not law abiding gun owners as good people.

Politicians: Often follow their Caucus BUT we need all the crossover we can get. DON'T make it a party issue, make it a principal issue!

Gun Owners: often mistake "shall not be infringed" as long as they can still hunt and don't get the bear arms part.

Permit holders: OC is a minority in the permit holder world. Most are discrete and choose to conceal. The Permit system is new enough to remember how we got here. It took a long time and careful planning to gain what we have without a lot of restrictions and bad legal language. You're making waves. Sometimes that leads to change and sometimes that change is good. That's not always the way to bet without careful consideration

3) Be the BEST example of the cause you can
This is mostly common sense and not giving the opposition any ammunition. You're probably the first Gun Righs group most people you meet have seen. Leave a good impression.

Cleanest
When doing activism: Dress more conservatively, put on clean crisp clothes. Pay attention to grooming: Do I need a haircut? Shower and shave right before heading out. etc... I'm not saying you're a slob. I'm saying that in any group, there's that one guy the rest would prefer had stayed home. Don't be the stereotype showing up in ratty and tattered camo clothes and the stars and bars.

Best informed
No matter who you interact with, you have to KNOW the facts, the law, and your message. Then you have to be able to CONSISTENTLY and CLEARLY communicate it. IT'S MY RIGHT is NOT effective communication. Tactical Timmy is NOT effective communication.
Why would you need more than 10 rounds? Reference the mother in Georgia who had 6 and the bad guy was still mobile. reference the trend of home invasions with multiple attackers and large group assaults. THINK of your arguments ahead of time. PREPARE your responses. DELIVER them calmly. DON'T GET FRUSTRATED. Look at what Piers Morgan did to Alex Jones vs what Ben Shapiro did to Piers!

Most Polite
Those nice guys with an odd habit leaves a much different impression than those jerks who were right and "technically" legal.

Safest
Don't touch the guns. Murphy loves a practical joke and he has a sick sense of humor. Wear a comfortable stable holster on a good belt.
Retention holsters would be a good idea if you're going to OC. .
Be aware of your muzzle. Think how you bend and where the muzzle is pointing.Even gunnies who KNOW it's safe when holstered don't like to look down the muzzle. Shoulder holsters would be a BAD idea.

While it's essential for EVERYONE at the event to follow the guidelines above and to KNOW THEIR STUFF, The most successful events I've been to had "event Marshals" or "Point people" - those who are most on message and the best public face. These are the people who should wander over to monitor any public contact and especially any official interaction. You cannot afford to be confrontational but should know your stuff...[/quote]

[tazdevil]

Most Polite
Those nice guys with an odd habit leaves a much different impression than those jerks who were right and "technically" legal.

Safest
Don't touch the guns. Murphy loves a practical joke and he has a sick sense of humor. Wear a comfortable stable holster on a good belt.
Retention holsters would be a good idea if you're going to OC. .
Be aware of your muzzle. Think how you bend and where the muzzle is pointing.Even gunnies who KNOW it's safe when holstered don't like to look down the muzzle. Shoulder holsters would be a BAD idea.

While it's essential for EVERYONE at the event to follow the guidelines above and to KNOW THEIR STUFF, The most successful events I've been to had "event Marshals" or "Point people" - those who are most on message and the best public face. These are the people who should wander over to monitor any public contact and especially any official interaction. You cannot afford to be confrontational but should know your stuff...

I'm not going to pick you apart, you've hit some very good points there. But one I will disagree on is the shoulder holster, and here's why: If your coming from the OC breakfast, it will go from OC to CC real fast when you put your anti-freeze-to-death winter apparel back on. In addition, many of those are level 1 or 2? with the retention snap strap. Finally, you can OC a empty holster on the waist, while CC'ing at the same time. Again, just a thought, not a attempt to pick you apart.

[Thunder71]

Whatever you guys do, please don't argue among each other over this at the rally... please. I appreciate the list, and recommendations and just ask that everyone respect each others personal, legal, choices, for just one day... you can do it!

[plblark]

I'm not going to pick you apart, you've hit some very good points there. But one I will disagree on is the shoulder holster, and here's why: If your coming from the OC breakfast, it will go from OC to CC real fast when you put your anti-freeze-to-death winter apparel back on. In addition, many of those are level 1 or 2? with the retention snap strap. Finally, you can OC a empty holster on the waist, while CC'ing at the same time. Again, just a thought, not a attempt to pick you apart.

You're right. I wrote the original for a summer event

[gunforhire]

Whatever you guys do, please don't argue among each other over this at the rally... please. I appreciate the list, and recommendations and just ask that everyone respect each others personal, legal, choices, for just one day... you can do it!

For real guys, we are in this together

If I see any arguments there, you WILL get a gibbs slap from me. don't know what that is?



It's a wake up call, not a show of disrespect. keep it together boners.