Respectfully, I do not want 'Constitutional Carry' in MN :)

[jgalt]

It's nice to see that we accept another persons opinion, isn't America great!!

No one is seeking to deny him his opinion. We're simply pointing out multiple reasons why it is flawed.

It is no virtue to accept an opinion without any rational basis...

[Evad]

It's nice to see that we accept another persons opinion, isn't America great!!

I don't want you saying things like that without a permit.

And I'm pretty sure there is no constitutional right be agreed with.


Thanks to my phone, I could have posted this from anywhere.

[bensdad]

It's nice to see that we accept another persons opinion, isn't America great!!

Seriously?!? His little "opinion" says that you don't have a natural right to protect your loved ones and property. That's not opinion. That's oppression.

[Pat Cannon]

It's nice to see that we accept another persons opinion, isn't America great!!

Seriously?!? His little "opinion" says that you don't have a natural right to protect your loved ones and property. That's not opinion. That's oppression.

It's his opinion, to which he's totally entitled. It's only oppression (on his part) if he's enforcing it. It's oppression on the state's part, sure. Happily, Minnesota has become less oppressive on this issue in the last ten years, but it's still wrong.

There's always some people, like Mr. Gunsmith, who think the current level of oppression is just the right amount. Ideally he will come to see the light by way of the thoughtful, reasoned argument available here.

[bstrawse]

Training is good, BUT, respectfully, requiring training and charging a license fee for exercising one's rights should be unconstitutional, just as a voter literacy test and a poll tax are unconstitutional.

Amen to that.
b

[gunsmith]

Ok Philosophically, I'll take 'the right to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED'

But practically, politically give Minnesota 36 months of 'Constitutional Carry' and Paymar & Lutz (need a snappy name here..."The infringement twins" will have to do for now.) will have a pack of bills ready to roll back RKBA as we have seen in other states.

I don't want to misquote anyone..but it was someone closely involved in Heller-McDonald admitting that doing away with 'permit to carry' was practically speaking a 'bridge too far'...don't want to attribute that to the wrong person but I think it was

Alan Gottlieb of the SAF.com. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Gottlieb

or

Alan Gura, lead attorney for Heller & McDonald. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alan_Gura

Once Carrying with a permit is woven into the fabric of Minnesota the next step would be Constutional Carry.

Quick Quiz: How recently was Carry (openly or concealed) without a permit legal in Minnesota? (Hint: Vikings lost SuperBowl to Steelers)

So just visualize Minnesota with 'Constitutional Carry' starting tomorrow:

HOW MANY KNUCKLEHEADS WILL BE DOING DRUNKEN KNUCKLEHEAD STUNTS AND EMBARRASSING THE ENTIRE 2A COMMUNITY ON A WEEKLY BASIS.

I think it would be the easiest way to roll back gun rights...

I'm finding myself plagiarizing a phrase that GOCRA uses effectively "chess not checkers"

I resent having to get a permit to exercise a fundamental natural right but I also remember relying on a 3 inch knife for protection.

I carry 24/7 due to the MCPPA 2003 (which took 15 years of continual uphill political struggle---thanks GOCRA !) and I live with A SMALL FRACTION OF THE FEAR OF GBH THAT I DID IN YEARS PAST. I can hold my breath for another 10 years while we 'perfect' the exercise of our rights

Meanwhile I'm celebrating Otis McDonald / Dick Heller

Otis McDonald



Dick Heller



Gura and Gottlieb with Otis McDonald

[Pat Cannon]

So just visualize Minnesota with 'Constitutional Carry' starting tomorrow:

HOW MANY KNUCKLEHEADS WILL BE DOING DRUNKEN KNUCKLEHEAD STUNTS AND EMBARRASSING THE ENTIRE 2A COMMUNITY ON A WEEKLY BASIS.

I think it would be the easiest way to roll back gun rights...

I'm finding myself plagiarizing a phrase that GOCRA uses effectively "chess not checkers"

I resent having to get a permit to exercise a fundamental natural right...

OK, so when you're saying "I do not want 'Constitutional Carry' in MN", you just mean, not yet?

[xd ED]

.....
So just visualize Minnesota with 'Constitutional Carry' starting tomorrow:

HOW MANY KNUCKLEHEADS WILL BE DOING DRUNKEN KNUCKLEHEAD STUNTS AND EMBARRASSING THE ENTIRE 2A COMMUNITY ON A WEEKLY BASIS.....

Isn't that sorta like saying if we let citizens carry guns we'll be reverting to the wild west/ OK Corral, there'll be blood in the streets, and fender-benders will turn into shoot-outs

[Rip Van Winkle]

[gunsmith]

So just visualize Minnesota with 'Constitutional Carry' starting tomorrow:

HOW MANY KNUCKLEHEADS WILL BE DOING DRUNKEN KNUCKLEHEAD STUNTS AND EMBARRASSING THE ENTIRE 2A COMMUNITY ON A WEEKLY BASIS.

I think it would be the easiest way to roll back gun rights...

I'm finding myself plagiarizing a phrase that GOCRA uses effectively "chess not checkers"

I resent having to get a permit to exercise a fundamental natural right...

OK, so when you're saying "I do not want 'Constitutional Carry' in MN", you just mean, not yet?

I can go with that.

Alaska has CC Bears everywhere

Arizona ...literally the wild west plus it's a 'border state'

Vermont....mostly pine trees, few people

Wyoming (for residents) Actual Cowboys and tumbleweed.

As it is Permit Holders are little angels and Lutz-Paymar want to dismantle the permit system.

36 months of 'Constitutional Carry' and the Feeble-Minded / mentally Border-line will embarrass the firearms community back to the Stone Age.

Stunts like this will be happening every weekend.

“I stopped and turned to walk to the middle of the parking lot. I made sure no one was around me,” she said. “I unholstered my gun, pointed it straight in the air and fired just one shot to get him off my child.”

Lakisha Gaither said she didn’t try to get away, and police eventually arrived.


“I didn’t feel like I was wrong,” she said. “I wanted to protect my child.”

But officers arrested her and charged her with reckless use of a weapon.

Prince William County police spokesman Officer Jonathan L. Perok said Ms. Gaither “should have called police instead of taking matters into her own hands.”

“You can’t fire into the air,” Officer Perok said. “Once something goes up, it comes down. There’s the possibility of causing property damage, injuring someone or killing someone. In an apartment complex, the odds of that bullet coming down and striking something are very high.”

No injuries or property damage were reported after the incident, but Officer Perok said police do not encourage confrontation and urge gun owners to use their weapons only in what they perceive to be life-threatening situations.

“The fact she stepped away from the crowd kind of shows she was not in an immediate danger type situation,” he said. “She may have been trying to break up the fight, but that’s not the proper course of action to take.”

Lakisha re-enacting her Kaboom.



Post Kaboom mugshot:

[SparkyJeff]

I resent having to get a permit to exercise a fundamental natural right...

OK, so when you're saying "I do not want 'Constitutional Carry' in MN", you just mean, not yet?

I can go with that.
...
36 months of 'Constitutional Carry' and the Feeble-Minded / mentally Border-line will embarrass the firearms community back to the Stone Age.

The elitism is strong in this one.

[Erud]

So just visualize Minnesota with 'Constitutional Carry' starting tomorrow:

HOW MANY KNUCKLEHEADS WILL BE DOING DRUNKEN KNUCKLEHEAD STUNTS AND EMBARRASSING THE ENTIRE 2A COMMUNITY ON A WEEKLY BASIS.

I think it would be the easiest way to roll back gun rights...

I'm finding myself plagiarizing a phrase that GOCRA uses effectively "chess not checkers"

I resent having to get a permit to exercise a fundamental natural right...

OK, so when you're saying "I do not want 'Constitutional Carry' in MN", you just mean, not yet?

I can go with that.

Alaska has CC Bears everywhere

Arizona ...literally the wild west plus it's a 'border state'

Vermont....mostly pine trees, few people

Wyoming (for residents) Actual Cowboys and tumbleweed.

As it is Permit Holders are little angels and Lutz-Paymar want to dismantle the permit system.

36 months of 'Constitutional Carry' and the Feeble-Minded / mentally Border-line will embarrass the firearms community back to the Stone Age.

Stunts like this will be happening every weekend.

“I stopped and turned to walk to the middle of the parking lot. I made sure no one was around me,” she said. “I unholstered my gun, pointed it straight in the air and fired just one shot to get him off my child.”

Lakisha Gaither said she didn’t try to get away, and police eventually arrived.


“I didn’t feel like I was wrong,” she said. “I wanted to protect my child.”

But officers arrested her and charged her with reckless use of a weapon.

Prince William County police spokesman Officer Jonathan L. Perok said Ms. Gaither “should have called police instead of taking matters into her own hands.”

“You can’t fire into the air,” Officer Perok said. “Once something goes up, it comes down. There’s the possibility of causing property damage, injuring someone or killing someone. In an apartment complex, the odds of that bullet coming down and striking something are very high.”

No injuries or property damage were reported after the incident, but Officer Perok said police do not encourage confrontation and urge gun owners to use their weapons only in what they perceive to be life-threatening situations.

“The fact she stepped away from the crowd kind of shows she was not in an immediate danger type situation,” he said. “She may have been trying to break up the fight, but that’s not the proper course of action to take.”

Lakisha re-enacting her Kaboom.



Post Kaboom mugshot:

Presumably, the point of this post is:

Requiring a permit to carry a firearm prevents incidents like this one from happening? Or what?

[bensdad]

The elitism is strong in this one.

Thank-you! I wanted to say it, but had already chimed in twice with negative energy.

[gunsmith]

.....
So just visualize Minnesota with 'Constitutional Carry' starting tomorrow:

HOW MANY KNUCKLEHEADS WILL BE DOING DRUNKEN KNUCKLEHEAD STUNTS AND EMBARRASSING THE ENTIRE 2A COMMUNITY ON A WEEKLY BASIS.....

Isn't that sorta like saying if we let citizens carry guns we'll be reverting to the wild west/ OK Corral, there'll be blood in the streets, and fender-benders will turn into shoot-outs

Good Point.

I'm NOT an instructor and probably never will be....but I HAVE OPINIONS and THEORIES.

One Theory is that it takes 2 years (possibly one) to "Learn to Carry'

Here's what I mean: the 'first six months' are actually 'easy' in that you know what to do...your instructor has literally scared the sheit out of you and you're walking on eggs and TRIPLE-THINKING every thing you do...

That's good for the first six months but you can't live practically and Triple-think everything.

Scared-Sheit-less that's part one....it will fade.

Part Two is: "THE TEMPERING EXPERIENCE" You've had one. I've had one.

"THE TEMPERING EXPERIENCE" is when you...'lose your temper while carrying a loaded firearm'

It's a turning point and it's an experience that can't be 'Staged' it's like a form of spiritual enlightenment...in that you can't learn it from a text-book or in a classroom.

You wind up (usually behind the wheel of a car after some A-hole has almost killed you) and you realize "Oh My God, I have a loaded gun in my pocket and I want to Kill / intimidate that A-hole who so richly deserves it"

A flash of inspiration follows: You realize that you need to live not one but two steps back from the edge of any confrontation. You realize that you have to let that drunken, illegal, retard smash up your new car and injure your passenger and YOUR FIREARM MUST NEVER ENTER THE EQUATION.

You will leave the encounter a 'changed man'

Training helps but you must learn this on your own. Requiring permits...'helps' and for some reason here in MN our 155,000 permit holders are not mucking things up every drunken weekend.

So....I think it takes a year for you to find your 'Tempering Experience' Training helps.

The whole concept of 'Constutional Government' is growing on me but I'm not an Idealist.

Constitutional Carry is #11 on my list of the top ten things we need to accomplish to support RKBA in MN.

[bensdad]

Project much?