MN gun control bill aims to close sales loophole

[TC95GT]

http://www.startribune.com/39844612.htm ... DEh7P:DiUs

Minnesota gun control bill aims to close sales loophole

By BOB VON STERNBERG, Star Tribune

February 19, 2009

Gun control advocates are taking another stab at changing a state law that allows people to buy handguns and assault rifles without a background check from unlicensed dealers.

A similar bill got nowhere in the legislature last year, but chief sponsor Rep. Michael Paymar, DFL-St. Paul, said he hopes tweaks in the bill's language will satisfy the measure's opponents.

"It's a good bill, a simple one designed to keep dangerous guns out of the hands of dangerous people," Paymar said.

The bill would close the so-called "gun show/Internet loophole." It would prohibit private sales of pistols or assault weapons unless the buyer or seller was a federally licensed dealer, or used a licensed dealer to transfer the weapon. That includes sales at garage and estate sales and over the Internet, which are currently exempt from background checks.

The bill is designed to block gun sales to convicted felons, people with a record of domestic abuse and those suffering from mental illness by requiring a background check that would reveal such people may not legally buy a gun, Paymar said.

Language in the bill that would have included private gun transactions between family members has been dropped from the legislation, he said.

The bill, which is to be introduced today, will be discussed at a news conference this afternoon held by Paymar, Citizens for a Safer Minnesota and the Peace Foundation of North Minneapolis.

[ttousi]

More to it than that.................PTP now cost money, PTC no longer works for purchase, FFL for all transactions....if the buyer don't qualify then they have to run the background check on the seller and if they don't pass (or system glitch) they turn the firearm over to local LEO

[ttousi]

linky


https://www.revisor.leg.state.mn.us/bin ... ssion=ls86

[ex-LT]

The permits and their renewal shall be granted free of charge for a fee not to exceed $5 above the expenses incurred by the chief of police or sheriff for processing the transferee permit application.

Had to read the bold a couple times to make sure I didn't misinterpret the wording. Am I the only one who sees this as a means for the police to charge whatever they want? I can see it now, if this passes, they're going to charge as much as they can possibly get away with, claiming that administrative costs make up all but $5 of that cost.

[hammAR]

The permits and their renewal shall be granted free of charge for a fee not to exceed $5 above the expenses incurred by the chief of police or sheriff for processing the transferee permit application.

Had to read the bold a couple times to make sure I didn't misinterpret the wording. Am I the only one who sees this as a means for the police to charge whatever they want? I can see it now, if this passes, they're going to charge as much as they can possibly get away with, claiming that administrative costs make up all but $5 of that cost.

...what, you think that a $1,000 per purchase is unreasonable administrative cost.......oops + $5 for the kitty..........

[westberg]

Ok, now that we know about it, how can it be stopped?

[ttousi]

E-mails to legislators...................does nothing to curtail the bad guys only penalizes law abiding folks, back door gun registration ie

Subd. 10a. Record keeping. All reports of transfer shall be maintained in a manner,
6.2as determined by the Department of Public Safety, that facilitates efficient crime gun
6.3tracing and ensures that the records are available for all lawful purposes, including being
6.4available to federal, state, and local law enforcement agencies for purposes of civil or
6.5criminal law enforcement investigations.

oh, and also looks like curios and relics would be affected as well

[DeanC]

Go here to look up their e-mail address: http://www.gis.leg.mn/mapserver/districts/

Tell them you oppose Rep. Michael Paymar's gun registration bill which will do nothing to prevent crimes and will only cause unnecessary hassle to law-abiding gun owners. We already have 4 laws that make illegal transfers illegal.

If this bill becomes law, violent criminals will not bother to follow this new law either.

*Be sure to also include your name and address so your rep knows that you are in their district.*

You can also e-mail the committee chair Debra Hilstrom

Here's some more information from GOCRA:

OPPOSE Rep. Michael Paymar's hidden gun registration bill!

Protect Minnesota and Citizens for a Safer Minnesota's "Gun Show Background Check (and hidden Gun Registration) bill," expected to be authored by Rep. Michael Paymar, is pure harassment of legitimate gun owners and their non-commercial disposition of their property because, as a 2008 empirical study by university Criminologists demonstrates , it will have NO EFFECT on homicides or suicides and provide NO REDUCTION in firearm-related deaths (or violent crime, for that matter). All it will do is impose unnecessary deprivation of liberty, hassle, delay, and cost on Minnesota's 1.5 million legitimate gun owners.

GOCRA encourages you to OPPOSE this bill.

1. A January 2009 Star-Tribune article says that the Twin Cities' homicide problem is largely one of uncontrolled gang/drug activity. Anyone who can sell or purchase illegal drugs can acquire a gun in that illegal transaction. An FBI report in February 2009 identifies "weapons trafficking" as a major GANG activity. Don't be fooled, these are black market transactions; not those of legitimate gun owners.

2. The legitimate market (consisting of licensed dealers and private citizens) is not the same thing as the "black market" (consisting of thieves, "fences," and "accomplices"). There are two distinct markets with different actors! In a Business Week column, Professor Gary Becker the Nobel Prize winner in Economics stated:
[t]here are two almost discrete markets for weapons. The legitimate market caters to people who want guns for hunting and for protection against holdups and burglaries. The [black] market caters to criminals who want weapons to help them steal, intimidate, rape, participate in gang warfare, and steal drugs. Becker goes on to note that controls on the legitimate sellers cannot have effect on an underground market that ignores those controls. CANNOT have any effect!!!

3. According to the federal Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco & Firearms less than 1 in 50 guns acquired by criminals come from gun shows or private resales. And virtually all of that tiny number comes from "strawman purchases" made by accomplices who CAN pass any background check (as the Va. Tach and NIU killers both DID).

4. Minnesota statutes already contain FOUR (4) provisions to cut off "black market" transfers. They are: (1) 609.52 – Theft by the criminal himself, (2) 609; (2) 609.53 – Theft-once-removed by acquisition from a "fence;" (3) 609.66 sibd. 1c – Receipt from an accomplice/strawman; and (4) 624.7141 – Transfer to an ineligible person.

5. The bill targets the wrong people and won't reduce murder or crime. It is simply a harassment bill to vex millions of law-abiding Minnesota gun owners. Perhaps that is why the Minnesota gun control act has never included these citizens and why the federal "Brady" Bill doesn't either!

[ex-LT]

The permits and their renewal shall be granted free of charge for a fee not to exceed $5 above the expenses incurred by the chief of police or sheriff for processing the transferee permit application.

Had to read the bold a couple times to make sure I didn't misinterpret the wording. Am I the only one who sees this as a means for the police to charge whatever they want? I can see it now, if this passes, they're going to charge as much as they can possibly get away with, claiming that administrative costs make up all but $5 of that cost.

...what, you think that a $1,000 per purchase is unreasonable administrative cost.......oops + $5 for the kitty..........

I doubt they'd go THAT high, but it wouldn't surprise me if they charged $50 - 75. After all, it's the same background check that they do for the P2C, and they charge $100 for that one.

[DeanC]

After all, it's the same background check that they do for the P2C, and they charge $100 for that one.

Which is the maximum allowed by law. Most counties break even or make money at that price and a couple seem to chronically lose money at that price.

[infidel]

Thanks for the links DeanC. Emails sent.

[nyffman]

I received a response from my Representative. Sounds like the anti crowd is blowing a lot of sunshine up the representatives asses to make this sound like a good bill. They need to hear from you or this will be passed. Be sure to give one or more substantive reasons why they need to oppose this bill.

Thank you for your insight on this bill. I am being lobbied by those who say this is a compromise bill. I appreciate you contacting me with this information.

[ex-LT]

I received a response from my Representative. Sounds like the anti crowd is blowing a lot of sunshine up the representatives asses to make this sound like a good bill. They need to hear from you or this will be passed. Be sure to give one or more substantive reasons why they need to oppose this bill.

Thank you for your insight on this bill. I am being lobbied by those who say this is a compromise bill. I appreciate you contacting me with this information.

I plan on contacting my legislator. Unfortunately, MY legislator is the freaking SPONSOR of the bill, so I'm guessing my comments will fall on deaf ears.

[BRSmith]

Sent an e-mail to both my represenitave and Mr. Paymar. Asked my represenitave to vote against it and told Rep. Paymer we don't need more gun control legislation, just enforcment of what we currently have.

[BRSmith]

Sent an e-mail to both my represenitave and Mr. Paymar. Asked my represenitave to vote against it and told Rep. Paymer we don't need more gun control legislation, just enforcment of what we currently have.