Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

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Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby UnaStamus on Sun Sep 28, 2014 4:52 pm

If anyone lives in Olmsted County, I would encourage you to support Kevin Torgerson for Olmsted County Sheriff.
http://www.torgersonforsheriff.com/

I've known Kevin for a long time, and he's very conservative, fiscally responsible, and big supporter of 2A. He's a really good guy too. I post this here because he's a lot more 2A friendly than the current sheriff (Mueller). In this day and age, sheriffs and police chiefs have a lot of influence with state legislatures when it comes to supporting or resisting firearms legislation. If we want to continue to strive for things like suppressors and such, we need to have support in more areas than just the House and Senate.

From his site:

Question: What is your position on the Second Amendment and Minnesota’s permit and carry law?


Answer: I have always stood firm on my support of the Second Amendment. If a citizen meets the statutory requirements, including completing the required background check and course, I support the right to carry. As a law enforcement professional, I have sworn to uphold the Constitutions of the United States and the State of Minnesota.
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby 2in2out on Sun Sep 28, 2014 7:06 pm

Thanks for posting that information. I don't live in Olmsted (and am therefore unable to vote for him), but work in Rochester and see signs up all over. Now I know which candidate to voice support for when/if anyone asks my opinion.
"...the liberties of the American people were dependent upon the ballot-box, the jury-box, and the cartridge-box; that without these no class of people could live and flourish in this country..." ---Frederick Douglass
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby dismal on Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:28 pm

He came up to the Pine Island club monthly meeting a few months ago, seemed to be pretty good. But, he mentioned something about wanting to change the training standards, possibly making them "better". I was going to ask him about what his ideas were, but didn't want to hold up the meeting, and couldn't hang around after the meeting to talk to him. If you see him, please ask him what his ideas are. Also, ask him if he's a GOCRA and MNGOPAC member. :)
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby marquette26 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 5:56 am

Must be a common issue with LEO, here is a statement from one of our Dodge County Sheriff candidate. I somewhat agree with the training requirement but on the instructor side of it.

"WHAT IS YOUR POSITION ON THE 2ND AMENDMENT....."

Another common question while door knocking and talking to supporters this weekend……..

“What is your position on the 2nd Amendment?”

The answer is simple: Of course I am pro 2nd Amendment!

There are 15 Sheriff’s Associations in the United States that have vowed to uphold and defend the Constitution against unconstitutional gun control measures. I am proud to say the Minnesota Sheriff’s Association is one of them. Minnesota Sheriff’s have taken an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of the State of Minnesota. I am looking forward to opportunity of working with like minded members of the Minnesota Sheriff’s Association to protect our right to bear arms, as well as other constitutional rights. While firearms certainly can be exploited by bad people, the number of legal permit holders in the state of Minnesota is growing year after year, 175,026 as of June 30th 2014. These Minnesotan’s lawfully possess and use firearms daily for protection and for recreation. The old adage, “Guns don’t kill people, people kill people”, continues to hold true. Gun Control laws and gun bans will never prevent “bad” people from accessing firearms. Believing it will reduce gun violence has been proven wrong over and over again.

As far as our concealed carry law is concerned, I have always been supportive of it. My only concern, and I’ve expressed this since this became law, is that we keep a high standard of training and education as a requirement for new permits and renewals. Our deputies train several times a year on the “use of force continuum” to know when lethal force is justified to be used. The concern is, as a citizen with a gun permit, you run the same civil and criminal risks as our deputies do when using their firearm in an incident – yet citizens only get retrained and renew their permit every 5 years. While this has always been a concern of mine, we’ve not yet had any major issues with permit holders since the law was put in place.

I hope this answers your questions about where I stand. If you have more questions regarding Permits to Carry here in Minnesota, check out the BCA link below for more frequently asked questions.

Enjoy the weather and have a great Sunday everyone!

Scott
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby marquette26 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 6:28 am

And I base my opinion off of the multiple emails like this that I receive, for too many instructors out there it is about the money and not the training quality they give to people. I guess you can say "We are our own worse enemy"

This is just one of maybe 5 in the last year.

Good Evening
I have a few questions. I took a permit to carry class from a guy out of Lonsdale MN. I feel as if I learned nothing from the class. I did get my permit but am not totally comfortable with everything. Do you do like a basic hand gun glass or maybe like personal training (not sure if that's the word I want to use ) of how to shoot properly ect.
Thank you
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby mrp on Mon Sep 29, 2014 6:44 am

marquette26 wrote:And I base my opinion off of the multiple emails like this that I receive, for too many instructors out there it is about the money and not the training quality they give to people. I guess you can say "We are our own worse enemy"

This is just one of maybe 5 in the last year.

Good Evening
I have a few questions. I took a permit to carry class from a guy out of Lonsdale MN. I feel as if I learned nothing from the class. I did get my permit but am not totally comfortable with everything. Do you do like a basic hand gun glass or maybe like personal training (not sure if that's the word I want to use ) of how to shoot properly ect.
Thank you


The permit to carry class does not cover the same material as a basic pistol class. Those who need both should take both. Those who don't, shouldn't. There's no evidence that lack of training is a problem. What's the issue?
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby marquette26 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:06 am

I understand that there has not been any issues with someone doing something wrong per say with their permit but I think you can agree that Instructors have an obligation to make people comfortable with the gun and the laws before signing off on them. It will only take one person messing up and saying that it was because of a lack of training to force the issue and make it harder for people to exercise the right to carry.
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby marquette26 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:13 am

My 1st Permit to Carry Class I took was in fact just a NRA Basic Pistol course, no mention of laws. I ended up finding another class to learn what was involved in carrying. There is a couple instructors in this area that still teach just a NRA Basic for the MN Permit. And if you're familiar with NRA courses you know that you can not talk about laws, weapons or deviate from the book. Would you call that proper training to prepare people to carry a gun?
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby mrp on Mon Sep 29, 2014 7:37 am

marquette26 wrote:There is a couple instructors in this area that still teach just a NRA Basic for the MN Permit.


Well, that's not good.
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/bca/bca-di ... ining.aspx
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby marquette26 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 8:33 am

SMSC, Inc Training:
Personal Protection In The Home (“PPITH”)—Available to those who have taken the NRA Basic Pistol Course or are
familiar with NRA Safety Rules and their firearm (qualifies for the Right To Carry)
o Jul 12, Sep 13, Dec 13
Basic Handgun Safety (“BHS”) Training (qualifies for the Right To Carry)
o Aug 9, Oct 11

SMSC, Inc. Education
 All education held at SMSC, Inc. is sanctioned by the SMSC, Inc. Board of Directors.
 The Basic Handgun Safety, Personal Protection In The Home, and Personal Protection Outside The Home classes are
recognized for the Right to Carry training requirements.
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby Thunder71 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 8:41 am

I find it ironic that Scott is concerned about education, when he himself refers to it as a "concealed carry law", he could benefit from some training on the subject himself, or at least call it what it is because he sounds uneducated on the subject when he does that.
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby marquette26 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:03 am

I agree, too many law enforcement do not know what all the laws are regarding the Permit to Carry in Minnesota, but on the other hand they have volumes of laws that they deal with on a daily basis and can not remember them all.
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby marquette26 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:06 am

In his defense I think it is just a easy term to use as he does say at the end " If you have more questions regarding Permits to Carry here in Minnesota, check out the BCA link below for more frequently asked questions. "

But either way it could lead to misconception of the laws by the uninformed.
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby Thunder71 on Mon Sep 29, 2014 9:10 am

marquette26 wrote:But either way it could lead to misconception of the laws by the uninformed.


That's the issue I have with it, especially when it comes from law enforcement.

Carry permit is easier, it's one less word. ;)
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Re: Olmsted County Sheriff Race - Kevin Torgerson

Postby UnaStamus on Wed Oct 01, 2014 9:21 pm

"Concealed carry permit" is a national generalist term at this point, much like in some places people say "coke" and mean pop or soda. Or when people say Kleenex when they really mean tissue. I know a lot of cops that say "concealed carry permit" and full well know that open carry is legal. They just call it that because they do. Most LE in MN are now fully aware that open carry is legal.

In reference to Kevin Torgerson, I can't put words in his mouth. If you want clarification, you can contact him and he or his campaign manager (my younger brother, who is as big of a gun nut as me) or another staff worker will respond to you with with Kevin's answer. The thing I CAN say is that many LE officials are not going to be overly specific about their interpretations and support intentions with relation to 2A. There are people who want Sheriffs like out in Utah who will openly say that they will refuse any order relating to gun control. There are others who simply want a Sheriff who is pro-gun. The problem is that a Sheriff is an elected position, and Olmsted county's biggest population is in Rochester, and Rochester is getting more and more liberal by the moment. It's not a place where a politician can openly make "right wing" pro-gun statements that the nanny-state libs might be afraid of. Like I said though, I cannot speak to what his intentions are.

The thing that he has mentioned about training is something I'm not familiar with. For me speaking from an LE perspective, the better trained the cops, the safer they are. The most dangerous cops I've known have been small town cops and deputies whose firearms training consists of 4 hours, once a year. I know of deputy who, when he retired, they had to cut his leather holster off of his revolver because it had been that long since he had shot it. In that regard, my supposition would be that he views training to be important for safety, but I can only say that from an LE perspective as a fellow cop. I hear a lot of horror stories of people at carry permit qualifications, and having formerly sold guns at Gander Mountain, there were a lot of people with zero firearms experience getting permits when I was. As a pro-2A guy, I don't think we should be REQUIRED to get mandatory training. However, as a responsible gun owner, I have zero respect and complete contempt for anyone that buys a gun and doesn't get proper training on how to use it.
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