Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

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Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby rucker on Wed Aug 29, 2007 4:06 pm

I thought this might be of interest to some people here :)
http://media.hamptonroads.com/media/con ... eting.html

By HARRY MINIUM, The Virginian-Pilot
© August 29, 2007

NORFOLK

More than 100 gun-rights advocates, most carrying handguns on their hips and wearing buttons saying "Guns Save Lives," came to the City Council on Tuesday night to protest what they called harassment of law-abiding gun owners by city officials.

The protest was called by the Virginia Citizens Defense League, a gun-rights group, after Chet Szymecki of Yorktown was arrested in June at Harborfest for carrying a gun.

Szymecki was arrested for violating a city ordinance banning guns at Harborfest - an ordinance that officials now acknowledge violates state law. City Attorney Bernard A. Pishko said city officials were unaware of a state law prohibiting localities from banning guns.

Carrying a weapon openly is legal in Virginia, even at a large gathering such as Harborfest. Once city officials realized their error, the charges against Szymecki were dropped.

"We made a mistake," Councilman Barclay C. Winn said. "It was unintentional."

Most who came to protest didn't appear to believe it was an innocent mistake.

"You know it was illegal," said Dave Vann, who drove from Falls Church to speak. "You arrested someone, and now it's going to cost you dearly."

Szymecki, a Navy veteran, said he was manhandled and hurt and that his wife, Deborah, his three children and two other children who accompanied them were traumatized. He said he has hired Norfolk attorney Stephen Merrill.

An emotional Deborah Szymecki told the council that after several police officers were done handcuffing her husband, she was left without money or the keys to the family car.

Others rose to describe incidents in which they said they were questioned and often handcuffed by police for simply carrying a firearm openly.

"Apparently you have some officers who don't understand the law," said the president of the Virginia Citizens Defense League, Philip Van Cleave of Midlothian.

The meeting drew more rowdy as it continued, with speakers receiving thunderous applause and some expressing disgust for the council. Some used unsavory terms to describe the police.

Councilman Paul R. Riddick left the meeting as gun-rights advocates began speaking, he said, in protest of their protest.

Kim Barton, who would not say where she lives, tried to speak but was told by Mayor Paul Fraim that she couldn't because she had not signed up to speak.

"I want to hear what she has to say," Vann said.

Fraim replied, "I'm running this meeting " and informed Vann his time to speak had expired.

Harry Minium, (757) 446-2371, harry.minium@pilotonline.com
Last edited by rucker on Wed Aug 29, 2007 5:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: moved to appropriate forum. I guess I will follow my own layout :)
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby EAJuggalo on Wed Aug 29, 2007 6:02 pm

This specific incident, with Szymecki, was less an issue with the police than it was an issue with the City Council drafting an ordinance that they knew from prior experience was preempted by state law. I'm waiting to see what he's going to ask for in damages and what the jury is going to award since there is no question the City deprived him of his rights.
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby Aquaholic on Wed Aug 29, 2007 11:11 pm

oooo, this one should be good! Exactly how we should respond should such a thing happen to one of ours.
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby Srigs on Thu Aug 30, 2007 5:58 am

Fraim replied, "I'm running this meeting " and informed Vann his time to speak had expired.


I'm sure the mayor would have 'made time' if he agreed with the position of the speaker. :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby plblark on Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:28 am

Aquaholic wrote:oooo, this one should be good! Exactly how we should respond should such a thing happen to one of ours.



Tactically, I'm not sure. But I know it should be reasoned, firm but relatively polite, and fairly coordinated. I think that this was a good opportunity to lodge a complaint and show the face of the movement. Unfortunately, what will make the news is that the "gun nuts" were rowdy and rude and derogatory to police.
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby Aquaholic on Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:42 am

I see your point, but I'm betting with the turnout and the "heat", that town won't be pulling a stunt like that on a permit holder again, and it should also give pause to any other town in the state comtemplating similar unlawful actions.
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby plblark on Thu Aug 30, 2007 8:51 am

I see yours as well, and some heat was definitely deserved. I'm just concerned about the ripple effect and unintended consequences. I'd like to score my hits without providing the enemy any ammunition to use against me if at all possible.
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby Thor on Thu Aug 30, 2007 10:31 pm

plblark wrote:Unfortunately, what will make the news is that the "gun nuts" were rowdy and rude and derogatory to police.


I think the answer to this is to REQUIRE the police to know the laws they are supposed to uphold. MN requires them to have a two year degree, so I know they are at least trainable. When I was performing those duties, I could nearly cite every single California law in the code book. Ignorance of the law is no excuse, and that holds true for either side. I would include the city councils. I don't like how laws in cities are just arbitrarily being made and sometimes how they're enforced, even the "illegal" laws, Duluth, for example. I know the cities have lawyers on retainer and I don't see why they can't run their proposed law by that counsel. That counsel should also be held to higher standards.
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby plblark on Fri Aug 31, 2007 6:50 am

no disagreement from me on that.
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby joelr on Fri Aug 31, 2007 9:56 am

Thor wrote:
plblark wrote:Unfortunately, what will make the news is that the "gun nuts" were rowdy and rude and derogatory to police.


I think the answer to this is to REQUIRE the police to know the laws they are supposed to uphold.
That would be a good start, sure. That said, any movement toward that hereabouts would result in high-pitched howls of protests from the police unions, since any honest testing -- No Cop Left Behind, and all that -- would be embarrassing to at least many of the fine public servants.
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Re: Gun-rights advocates stage protest at Norfolk council meetin

Postby xd9 on Tue Sep 04, 2007 11:46 pm

For those interested in hearing this part of the meeting, you can listen here.
46 minutes and it sounds like the group recorded it for all to hear.

http://www.vcdl.org/Norfolk/NorfolkCityCouncil082907.mp3


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