How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

A place to post documents and information

How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby hammAR on Sun Dec 27, 2009 11:03 am

Since there seems to be a lot of questions regarding choosing a rifle scope I will start a thread to attempt to address same. While I am not an expert at optics and such, I will be referring to what I consider are experts and their collective wisdom in a series of articles. Further, I will add to this thread the information that goalie posted, just so that we can have all like materials in a single thread for future reference.

First you need to ask yourself a question? Why do you want a scope? There are many reasons for having a scoped rifle. Helps to shoot more accurate, longer ranges, faster recovery, range estimation, and better target identification.

How many of us have played the holster game? We buy a cheap one before we knew any better. Then next thing you know we got one gun with two or three unused holsters and one that we wear all the time. If we would have known better in the beginning maybe we could have saved money, time and only bought one holster and spent the rest of the money on ammo. That is what this is about, just a little insight on scopes.

A few things to consider when buying a scope: price, durability, power setting, adjustments, reticle, low light capabilities, size of the objective, and accessories. Let''s look at each:

Price
There are tons of scopes out there anywhere from $100 to unlimited. But you will spend between $400 and $2000 for one depending which one you get. Some people say you should spend at least as much on your scope as you do your rifle. There are a lot of good products out there in each price range. You have to decide on what price range you want while looking at the rest of the features

Durability
If you have ever taken classes I am sure you have seen a gun dropped, thrown, kicked, or even buried. It happens! Guns are tools we use for many excuses but only one reason, to shoot. If you feel you need to baby your gun you are looking in the wrong area. But if you except the fact that your gun might get dropped and when it does happen you reconfirm your zero and move on then you are in the right mindset. Whatever scope you buy you need to do some test with the adjustments. Make sure you can shoot a square with it. It doesn''t have to be perfect but shoot two shots then move it left ten clicks, shoot two more. Move it up ten clicks, shoot two more. Move it right ten clicks, shoot two more. Lastly, move it down ten clicks and shoot two more. Your last two shots should be close to your first two. If not do it again and see if it is consistent. If your scope will not do it think about sending it back. Always make sure all scope screws are tight at least once a month if not every time you go to the range. You should hear and feel a "click" when turning the adjustments knobs.

Power setting
How well do you need to see the target? Are you looking at a criminal with a black glove on or a gun? Are you shooting at a deer 100 yards away or Iraqis at 1,000 yards away? If you just need to see the target whatever the distance a power setting not more than 10-14x for closer distances will do. A variable with lower power would come in handy. But if you need to tell the difference between Buchie and Charlie before you put a bullet in him you might want a variable up to 20 power. It comes in handy for spotting and target identification. Plus the better you can see the target the more accurately you can place the crosshairs. For lower caliber rifles a 4 or 6 power might be the best bet due to shorter maximum effective range. Keep in mind the higher the power the more wind and mirage will distort the clarity. Also if shooting from an unstable position a lower power setting appears to not jump around as much.

Adjustments
There are scopes that you need to use tools to make your adjustments from one yard line to the next and ones that you can turn by hand. I am not talking about zeroing here. If it is going to be a tactical scope you must be able to turn it by hand. There are knobs that have covers and some that are open. Again as long as you make sure it is on the right setting before you shoot it is not a problem to have either.

There are 1/4 MOA* (see bottom), 1/2 MOA* and 1 MOA* increment adjustments then there are scopes that have bullet drop compensators. Do not screw with a 1/8 MOA, as they are purely for paper. They will have bold numbers on them that once zeroed will act as a guide for which yard line equals what scope setting to use. They normally have a fine tuning of 1/4 or 1/2 MOA* for more accurate adjustments. If you have to put it on 5 for 500 yards and then shoot it is quicker and easier than remembering 14 minutes up from 0 and then did I go the right way or not? I personally prefer something with 1/4 MOA* increments for the fine tune accuracy.

Reticle
There are a lot of different reticles out there duplex, cross hairs, and mildot are some of the most common. To view more go to Leupold''s reticle page.

There is also Gen 2 Mildots which are better because they have a center 1/2 mil reading (more accurate) line. Premier Reticles makes the Gen 2 Mildot.

I can only discuss the Mildot, as I do not have experience with other reticle styles, except for play and personally do not find them usable. The Mildot reticle is growing and has been used by the military for years. They are useful for more than just range estimation. They are also good for holds in wind and elevation and can be used for leads on moving targets. If you never have any intention on needing mildots don''t waste your money. If it is strictly going to be a 100 yard target rifle you don''t need them. You can also get them added later by Premier Reticle.

To use the mildot reticle for Range Estimation use the following formula:

Height of the target in inches multiplied by 27.77. Then divided that by the number of mils read and that will equal the range in yards.

One mil is actually measured from the crosshair to the center of the first mil dot. You want to break that down into .10th''s. The round mildot is .20th of a mil If your target is half way between the cross hairs and the first mil dot the mil reading would be .5 mils. If it is from the crosshairs to the bottom edge of the first mil dot it is .9 mils. From the crosshairs to the top edge of the second mil dot would be 2.1 mils.

Low light capabilities
I am a big fan of Illuminated reticles. I know there are plenty of times we can see the target in our scopes due to house, vehicle, or street lights, illums, popups, sun or moon light. But the problem is we can''t see the crosshairs in low light. That is where illuminated reticles (ILR) come in. Different companies make them and some only light up the center with a dot or just the center + and some light up the entire reticle. Now If you have the money and it applies to you only one thing can beat illuminated reticles. That is night vision scopes. Or night vision attachments for your scope. Make sure if it is a day / night scope it still has an illuminated reticle. Night Vision Devices (NVD) tend to wash out when there is ambient light on or near the target. That''s when you would need to switch to the day scope and use the ILR. Of course if you are using a scope that uses batteries make sure you have extras with your rifle at all times. They will go out when you need them most.

Other than expensive scopes you can use a one inch chemlight taped up inside your ocular lens (The part toward the rear of the rifle that you look through) to illuminated the cross hairs. Tape most of it up so it is not as bright.

Can you see the light inside the scope at night? Yes, if you are at the muzzle end looking through the objective lens. Will it matter? Depends on your job but it is so minuet that most of the time it doesn''t.

Size of the objective lens
The larger objective lens you have the more light you will be able to gather into the scope. If it is getting dark the crosshairs inside a larger objective lens will be visible longer. It also is bigger so it raises the scope up above the barrel higher so you will need higher rings and a higher cheek piece. Which in turn gives you a higher silhouette. But again the difference is minuet. The larger the lens the more field of view you have as well as the lower power the larger field of view.

Accessories
Bases, rings, and scope covers are all part of the package of buying and choosing a scope. Bases come in one piece and two piece, tapered and flat. One piece bases are better. They keep the rifle and scope together better and what we want is consistency to shoot good tight groups. A one piece base flexes less than a two piece will. A tapered base is needed for adjustments at longer ranges. Some scopes run out of elevation adjustments around 600 yards. By having a base that has a 20 MOA taper it allows you to save more elevation for the longer ranges.

Rings from Badger, Leupold, and GG&G are all good. Something that will tighten properly and not strip out in case you need to change it. Hex head screws are better than allen screws.

Scope covers are a must. Why spend so much on a scope and not buy at least some Butler Creek Covers or a rubber $5.00 bikini cover from Walmart for your scope?

Data cards
MANDATORY: For data cards, ballisticards are a good start. They use different ammo and rifle specs you set up at what ranges and what zero. It is a good starting point and I have found that most of them are very close to what my rifle shoots. Also, you should create a "book" for every rifle that you own and shoot.....

I hope this clears up any questions you might have had about scopes and what is out there. In the hierarchy of Survival the proper order is MINDSET, TACTICS, SKILL, and EQUIPMENT. Snipers, Sharpshooters, Designated Marksman, Marksman / Observers, and Precision Rifle Shooters all require different equipment than others.

Buy it once, learn to use it, then continue to learn to use it better, faster, and more accurate.

*MOA - Minute of Angle: For every 100 yards one minute of angle (MOA) equals one inch 1 MOA at 100 yards = 1 inch 1 MOA at 200 yards = 2 inches 1 MOA at 300 yards = 3 inches ect... 1/2 MOA at 100 yards = 1/2 inch 1/2 MOA at 200 yards = 1 inch 1/2 MOA at 300 yards = 1 1/2 inches ect... 2 MOA at 100 yards = 2 inches 2 MOA at 200 yards = 4 inches 2 MOA at 300 yards = 6 inches etc...


******************************************************************************************************************************

Starting out with the basics....read more needed information here:
How to Choose a Riflescope - Rifle Scope Expert's Guide to Firearm Optics!

goalie: After reading the targets thread, I thought some people could use this. I'm all for paying your dues and stuff, but ammo is too damn expensive nowdays to sight-in with more than 4 rounds.....
How to set up your scope 101

.
All men are created equal....It's what they do from there that matters!.
User avatar
hammAR
 
Posts: 11591 [View]
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 3:31 pm
Location: Cultural Liaison....

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby farmerj on Sun Dec 27, 2009 11:34 am

there are TONS of links to information like that.
http://topqualityscopes.com/choosing-th ... ifle-scope

Here is probably one of the most interesting and complete compilations I have seen. And it's a local Minnesota company.
http://www.eabco.com/Reports/report01.html

Anywho...

Repeatability - How well does the POI follow the POA. Can you adjust the turrets and bring it back to the same original POI/POA. Typically you do this by zeroing the scope. Once you are satisfied, up 5 Clicks or a chosen amount. You could go 20 if you are using a scope that has 1/8 Minute clicks. You just want it away from the original point.

5 Up
5 Right
5 Down
5 Left.

Your rounds should be about back into the original hole.

1 plane vs 2nd Plane reticle. Follow the links in the link. It will matter mainly if you have a ranging reticle. Even if you use the duplex reticle that most scopes come with, it will matter if you take the time to learn to range with that.

Paralax adjustmentwill be more important than anything. If the reticle seems to move around the target, you are having parallax issues. Most scopes are set up for about an 80-110 yard parallax adjustment from the factory unless you buy a scope with adjustable parallax. Mind you...This is more an issue with the variable power scopes.

Power - More is not always better. In the Army, I worked primarily with a 4X ICOG scope. This was more than enough magnification for anything we did. I did get to try our 10X sniper Leupold. I wasn't sold on it. Damn nice glass, but still, I can't justify the money for the functionality. Even with Bino's, anything over 10X was a PITA to work with. Unless it's stabilized, it's just too hard to work with.

Additionally with Power. Your eyes should both be open with using a scope. Seems counter intuitive, but they should. Up to 4X magnification, your mind can deal with the power difference in your vision. Over 4X, you need to start closing one eye. It will effect your accuracy.

Light transmission - Oye. Is it from objective size, or is it from glass coatings? More than likely it's from the Glass coatings. THIS is where you will get your moneys worth. The really expensive glass has the coatings for the light transmission.

A "simple" test to compare scopes. Use a resolution test pattern. You can print one out from there and test it on your scopes at home. Look at the chart from a 45 degree angle. Have some fun too with your camera and bino's. Cameras you can tell if you are front or rear focusing on your auto-focus.

Just a surface of what can and needs to be looked at.
We reap what we sow. In our case, we have sown our government.
Current moon phase
User avatar
farmerj
 
Posts: 4801 [View]
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2007 9:11 am
Location: The edge of the universe in the vertex of time on the space continuum of confusion

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby jgalt on Sun Dec 27, 2009 12:38 pm

Spec-frickin'-tacular! :bowdown:

I've read what both of you have written, and have started in on the links - great & helpful information for someone of my current knowledge base (read - very low...). This should help tremendously in choosing an appropriate scope for my needs, so that I can get beyond the 'what to buy' stage, and on to the much more important - and fun - 'shoot the damn thing' stage... :D
jgalt
 
Posts: 2377 [View]
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:45 pm
Location: Right here...

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby westberg on Sun Dec 27, 2009 2:25 pm

jgalt wrote:Spec-frickin'-tacular! :bowdown:

I've read what both of you have written, and have started in on the links - great & helpful information for someone of my current knowledge base (read - very low...). This should help tremendously in choosing an appropriate scope for my needs, so that I can get beyond the 'what to buy' stage, and on to the much more important - and fun - 'shoot the damn thing' stage... :D

Sorry, but it should read "shoot the **** damn thing". You need to start using the correct terminology. :P :lol: :lol:

Thanks guys and please keep adding to this. When does the class actually start, I think January is a good time to get all of the temperature ranges covered. :hmm:
User avatar
westberg
 
Posts: 4830 [View]
Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 7:42 pm
Location: Wyoming, MN

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby jgalt on Sun Dec 27, 2009 2:32 pm

westberg wrote:
jgalt wrote:Spec-frickin'-tacular! :bowdown:

I've read what both of you have written, and have started in on the links - great & helpful information for someone of my current knowledge base (read - very low...). This should help tremendously in choosing an appropriate scope for my needs, so that I can get beyond the 'what to buy' stage, and on to the much more important - and fun - 'shoot the damn thing' stage... :D

Sorry, but it should read "shoot the ******* damn thing". You need to start using the correct terminology. :P :lol: :lol:

<snip>


I do my best to keep up, but as this is some serious ****, I usually just end up waiting to see how it all pans out... 8-)
jgalt
 
Posts: 2377 [View]
Joined: Tue Mar 18, 2008 5:45 pm
Location: Right here...

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby TC95GT on Sun Dec 27, 2009 3:40 pm

Outstanding posts with some great information. I got some reading to do.

westberg wrote:When does the class actually start

I'm in. ;)
"It is not enough to just obey Big Brother, you must love him, too." 1984 by George Orwell
User avatar
TC95GT
 
Posts: 1221 [View]
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 4:19 pm

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby justaguy on Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:48 am

We need the MOA vs Mil discussion covered too...... :didntdoit: :didntdoit: :hide: :hide: :blah: :blah: :wack: :wack: :poundon: :poundon:
WWTNSTKBLD
(What Would The Navy SEALs That Killed Bin Laden Do)
justaguy
 
Posts: 7402 [View]
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 1:37 pm
Location: Minnesota?

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby Vlad on Mon Dec 28, 2009 1:46 pm

Do us all a favor and just stick to the 1911 vs glock debate... ;) :wack: :hammer:
http://www.Schleifleather.com For custom holsters that fit you and the gun, not to mention show off those Strad grips...

The cost of liberty is less than the price of repression."

--W.E.B. Du Bois,
American scholar and civil rights leader
User avatar
Vlad
 
Posts: 1085 [View]
Joined: Sun Nov 25, 2007 10:04 pm
Location: Central MN

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby justaguy on Tue Dec 29, 2009 11:37 am

Vlad wrote:Do us all a favor and just stick to the 1911 vs glock debate... ;) :wack: :hammer:

Its GLOCK vs 1911.........
WWTNSTKBLD
(What Would The Navy SEALs That Killed Bin Laden Do)
justaguy
 
Posts: 7402 [View]
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 1:37 pm
Location: Minnesota?

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby bucktail on Sat Feb 27, 2010 12:43 pm

While a bigger objective will gather more light, it will only make the image appear brighter up to a point. If you divide the objective size by the power setting, you get what is called the exit pupil. The image will only appear brighter as the objective gets larger if the exit pupil is smaller than your eye pupil. As a rule of thumb, the pupil of your eye can dilate to ~7mm when you are young. This will decrease as you get older. So in a fixed 6X scope, there is no improvement to image brightness by going with an objective lens bigger than 42mm. If you're running a variable with a moderately sized objective, you can get a brighter image by turning down the power. For example, in a 3-9X40, the image will be brighter for most people if the power is set no higher than 6 or 7X. Having a bigger exit pupil will allow you to see through the scope it your eye is not in perfect alignment to it, but the downside is that you will be aiming slightly off if you are not shooting at the distance that your scope is parallax free at.

Eye relief is another consideration. Eye relief is that distance that your eye is from the ocular lens when the image is focused and fills the scope. A scope that gives a full image at varying eye relief is said to have a generous eye box. For heavy kickers, you will want a lot of eye relief. This allows the gun to recoil back further without giving you "scope brow", "sniper eye" of whatever you call the cut that you get when the scope comes back to bite you because your eye was too close to it when you pulled the trigger. All things being equal, you will lose some field of view by going to a longer eye relief, but within reason, it is a good trade off.
bucktail
 
Posts: 98 [View]
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 8:33 pm

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby farmerj on Sat Feb 27, 2010 7:46 pm

regarding objective size vs power.

objective size divided by power. IE 50mm/14X is a 3.6 mm exit pupil. Full day light it won't be bad, but when you take into account low evening or day time it becomes a factor.

You want to try and stay above a 4mm exit pupil. The below chart gives you a good layout of which powers and objective sizes will get you in that range/ball park.
Attachments
scopechart.jpg
scopechart.jpg (23.87 KB) Viewed 6391 times
We reap what we sow. In our case, we have sown our government.
Current moon phase
User avatar
farmerj
 
Posts: 4801 [View]
Joined: Fri Aug 10, 2007 9:11 am
Location: The edge of the universe in the vertex of time on the space continuum of confusion

Re: How to Choose a Riflescope...........reference section

Postby bucktail on Sat Feb 27, 2010 9:06 pm

The size of the exit pupil that you want all depends on application. If the animal that you're hunting is crepuscular like a deer, then you want to optimize the scope for low light, and I'd want to be able to get 6mm exit pupil minimum. On a rifle for colony varmints, exit pupil is a non-factor. I have a 6-18X44 that is plenty bright at 18X during the day, even if it's cloudy. Lots of guys like 6-24X40's for prairie dogging which gives you an exit pupil of less than 2mm when set at 24X. I don't like a lot of magnification though. I'd been mostly open sights up until about 10 years ago, and I'm still not that good at target acquisition with them at high power. When it's hot you get mirage from the barrel heat at high magnification, and you lose field of view so that you can't see your hits, which takes part of the fun out of varmint shooting.
bucktail
 
Posts: 98 [View]
Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 8:33 pm


Return to Reference

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron