another shooting at bills

[jagger22]

Was up at bills north today, and someone decided to carlessley discharge there pistol into there leg...

[Stradawhovious]

Lucky for them it was their leg and not someone else's

[someone1980]

I was pulling up just as they were wheeling the guy out. Wonder what happened.

Thanks for the info.

[MNBud]

It sure is nice to have someone reporting straight from Bills north,two postings and they are both from up north. Have all your other trips there been un-eventful?

[someone1980]

Here is the thing. Firearm ranges attract people with firearms who want to shoot them. The problem comes in when people either don't know the 3 (or 4) rules, or don't follow them. There are three things that I do to deal with dumb asses on the range.

1. Walk over and give them a few pointers if they look like new people, or ask them is a pissed off voice not to point their firearms at me.
2. Tell the staff what the deal is (this should get the people a loud and public talking to or kicked off the range)
3. Leave.

[gunshop guy]

Yelling at someone on the range has never truly proved to be an effective tool. It has been my experience that removing someone from an unsafe situation and explaining why the actions they are taking are not safe, acceptable, or allowed, usually gets better results. Public humilition breeds contempt and anger, and neither of those are a good things on a range.

If you are using a range and you see something unsafe, please let the range officer know ASAP. They will handle the situation as quickly and safely as possible. That goes for any range.

So, I should note that this is my personal opinion. I am not responding as a Bill's employee.

[Einthoven's Triangle]

The best Bill's story I have is in the early 90's a good friend and I went to go shooting in the morning. We were set up and shooting. I got in the airlock with a guy that breathed all over me, he had an Alcohol like odor! I mean UFDA! I walked up to the range office as I was on my way to use the restroom, and advised him of what I thought of that guy. The range officer promptly went out on the range and removed the fellow, refunding his $$. Well, this guy evidnetly left with no fuss, but then went over and shot up his X's car at her home................that last part was related the next time we used the range.......

[gungal]

Unfortunately the staff at most public gun ranges are no better at handling guns safely than the morons who are pointing their guns at themselves or somebody else.
The best thing you can do is just not go to public ranges.

Join a reputable club and then be careful.
Always make sure you know the person who is near you and watch their gun handling skills.

Good Luck

[Squib Joe]

Unfortunately the staff at most public gun ranges are no better at handling guns safely than the morons who are pointing their guns at themselves or somebody else.

That hasn't been my experience at all, at either private or public ranges.

[David]

I agree with Joe. Certainly there are range employees whose gun handling isn't stellar, but I've never seen it, and I'd guess that it isn't all that common. Definitely not "most."

I do agree, however, with the fact that you'll have less trouble with the inexperience factor at a private range. I've found most private clubs to be pretty safe and fun.

Regarding the incident at Bill's, I was there earlier in the day, but left before all the drama. I did hear from another customer who was still there though that the shooting was by a person in a renewal class, and that he took his gun out for some reason on the sales floor, not the range, and managed to touch-off two shots, at least one of which grazed his leg. Ouch.

[Don L]

I belong to a couple of private clubs, and it's been my experience that I've witnessed just as much "sloppy gunhandling" at the two of them as I have at "open to the public" ranges, either indoor or outdoor. Example: two weeks ago, at a private club, a family walked up to the table next to mine, and one of them proceeded to uncase handguns and set them on the bench, pointed at "yours truly". When I (politely, by the way) asked them to turn the muzzles downrange, one of them looked at me like I asked them to give me their first born, or something like that. I decided it was time to take a break.With Permit classes, either mine, or classes coming in when I'm helping out at BPR, as much as the students are reminded of the rules, I've noticed that they're focused on the qual, and sometimes part of what's said to them goes right over their heads. Part of the problem is that they're new to the facility, and unfamiliar with the rules.With very few exceptions, the instructors are vigilant, and catch small mistakes before they can become big ones.

[Pat]

Sounds like an experience at one of my favorite "big box stores" (name to remain unspoken, to protect my good graces). It's not so much the staff, as the customers, who routinely receive a shotgun/pistol/rifle over the counter and proceed to examine it, completely without regard to the 4 basics.

After being muzzled with a 12 gauge this last Wednesday, I thought I had tactfully pointed out the error. But the DumArse gave me the look. I just moved on...

[rtk]

I belong to a couple of private clubs, and it's been my experience that I've witnessed just as much "sloppy gunhandling" at the two of them as I have at "open to the public" ranges, either indoor or outdoor. Example: two weeks ago, at a private club, a family walked up to the table next to mine, and one of them proceeded to uncase handguns and set them on the bench, pointed at "yours truly". When I (politely, by the way) asked them to turn the muzzles downrange, one of them looked at me like I asked them to give me their first born, or something like that. I decided it was time to take a break.With Permit classes, either mine, or classes coming in when I'm helping out at BPR, as much as the students are reminded of the rules, I've noticed that they're focused on the qual, and sometimes part of what's said to them goes right over their heads. Part of the problem is that they're new to the facility, and unfamiliar with the rules.With very few exceptions, the instructors are vigilant, and catch small mistakes before they can become big ones.

Had the same experience at most likely the same range that DonL is talking about. I had been there for about 10 minutes when another member showed up and as he started to unload his bag at the table next to me I could see that I needed to evacuate in rapid order. When he asked where I was going in such a hurray, I told him I had a busy day ahead of me and needed to get going. I debated using it as a teachable moment but felt the best thing to do was just make distance quickly.

RTK

[aviator]

I was at a gun shop in Oregon a couple of weeks ago and asked to see a firearm. In the course of getting the gun out of the showcase and "checking" to be sure it was unloaded, the clerk muzzled me at least twice. Turns out, he was a retired LAPD cop. Go figure. Hank.

[Don L]

Hey RTK, you're right-same club. Then there was the time last summer where the senior shooting next to me started using his armpit to hold the handgun when not shooting it, sweeping past everyone to put it there. And how about the guy that would look down the barrel after each shooting sequence, to make sure there wasn't any obstructions in the barrel? I turn these into "teachable moments" whenever I can, especially if young people are observing. I keep the mood light, and usually it's well recieved. What I do is start out the conversation with "can I show you a better way", instead of "you're doing that wrong". IMHO, there's way too many "bad habits" getting passed to newer shooters from folks that haven't had correct firearms education themselves (and I've got relatives guilty of this!). One of my favorites happened at BPR a few years ago. A guy about 25 was barely holding a little .25 with two fingers, so close to his face that if he fired, the slide would hit his nose. When I said something, he replied with "I was in the Marines-there's nothing you can teach me about shooting". I replied with "I'll bet the Marines didn't teach you to shoot like that!" He didn't say much. Ms T has some interesting stories from OGC, also (some of them involve LEO's) Say, we've got the start of a book here.......