My view from the range at Bill's in Robbinsdale today

[XDM45]

As someone who has spoken to a fair number of Bill's employees, they're range safety record isn't the best with a few employees. One particular incident at Bill's North that is pretty outrageous, a .50 AE Desert Eagle being returned from the range was simply put into a clearing barrel and fired, without the chamber ever being check for being clear. That employee still works at BGS (in a leadership position), there is no place for that sort of irresponsibility to be tolerated at a business that should ran by competent, and safe, employees. The employees are actually told by management to transport all of the class 3(full autos) outside of their cases(unlike the other weapons that they rent) to and from the range. Seems weird that John wouldn't know about such a policy? So they're actually encouraged to leave them out of the cases and put them on the back counters. If you like the rentals, BGS is a good place, but safety can be very lacking from both patrons and employees (who often can't be bothered with the light of day). The range is also filthy at times, air filters are often unchanged and dirty (leaving an eerie, toxic, grey cloud in the range), use many bristle brooms to push lead particles in the range only forces them into the air for everyone else to breath.

Yeah the air quality sucks indeed. I didn't know that about the DE incident (and I'm sure there's others), so with that and the air, even more reasons not to go there. If I buy a gun from them, I'll see if I can get some boxes of ammo vs. the free range pass and rental they give out. Do you or anyone else know a safer, cleaner range which rents guns? As much as I dislike the rent-a-boomstick-crowd, it's the only way I know of where you can choose a gun to fire. If not for the rental places like that, the only other way is to by chance run into someone at a range with a gun you want to try and who let's you try it.

Thanks for the additional info, it only further justifies my boycott of their range after reading the original post with photos.

[ex-LT]

Do you or anyone else know a safer, cleaner range which rents guns?

The only other indoor ranges in the metro are BPR and Gander. Neither one rents guns.

[goett047]

Metro Gun Club in Blaine will rent I believe. Call to see what kind of selection he has though.

[t140]

Sealed Mindset's rentals are free.

[mnarguy556]

The Discharge happened last April, while the store was PACKED. They don't rent Desert Eagles anymore (like it was the guns fault...). Part of the reason why the range at BGS gets as unsafe as it does, IMO, is because the employees (especially on weekends) are often slated to work 12 hr shifts back to back 9-9. Yet they're expected to safely run a range, operate the full sales-floor, be friendly and helpful, and observant. All of that oftentimes with two people in the whole store (next time you're there, count how many are doing what). If you ever take a close look at Bills North, there's nowhere for the employees to sit or to have an official break (if the classroom has a class). You cannot fully, realistically, expect employees who are wore down after double 12 hr shifts on a Sunday night at 8 pm, to watch the range with the same care that they started the day with at 9am. Those kinds of hours are as unsafe for the patrons safety as they are (reportedly) unbearable for the staff.

[XDM45]

The Discharge happened last April, while the store was PACKED. They don't rent Desert Eagles anymore (like it was the guns fault...). Part of the reason why the range at BGS gets as unsafe as it does, IMO, is because the employees (especially on weekends) are often slated to work 12 hr shifts back to back 9-9. Yet they're expected to safely run a range, operate the full sales-floor, be friendly and helpful, and observant. All of that oftentimes with two people in the whole store (next time you're there, count how many are doing what). If you ever take a close look at Bills North, there's nowhere for the employees to sit or to have an official break (if the classroom has a class). You cannot fully, realistically, expect employees who are wore down after double 12 hr shifts on a Sunday night at 8 pm, to watch the range with the same care that they started the day with at 9am. Those kinds of hours are as unsafe for the patrons safety as they are (reportedly) unbearable for the staff.

I know it's hard to get an employee's attention at times due to how busy they are at ANY gun store right now.

Bill's needs to:

1) Clean up the air in the range.
2) Have more staff on-hand working 8 hour shifts with a 1 hour unpaid lunch break (9 hour day) with an area for them to break in (plus 2 15 minute breaks paid.)
3) Hire several staff who are dedicated RSOs.

[XDM45]

Metro Gun Club in Blaine will rent I believe. Call to see what kind of selection he has though.

Thanks. I'll check them out.

[mnarguy556]

The Discharge happened last April, while the store was PACKED. They don't rent Desert Eagles anymore (like it was the guns fault...). Part of the reason why the range at BGS gets as unsafe as it does, IMO, is because the employees (especially on weekends) are often slated to work 12 hr shifts back to back 9-9. Yet they're expected to safely run a range, operate the full sales-floor, be friendly and helpful, and observant. All of that oftentimes with two people in the whole store (next time you're there, count how many are doing what). If you ever take a close look at Bills North, there's nowhere for the employees to sit or to have an official break (if the classroom has a class). You cannot fully, realistically, expect employees who are wore down after double 12 hr shifts on a Sunday night at 8 pm, to watch the range with the same care that they started the day with at 9am. Those kinds of hours are as unsafe for the patrons safety as they are (reportedly) unbearable for the staff.

I know it's hard to get an employee's attention at times due to how busy they are at ANY gun store right now.

Bill's needs to:

1) Clean up the air in the range.
2) Have more staff on-hand working 8 hour shifts with a 1 hour unpaid lunch break (9 hour day) with an area for them to break in (plus 2 15 minute breaks paid.)
3) Hire several staff who are dedicated RSOs.

My feelings exactly.

[xd ED]

The Discharge happened last April, while the store was PACKED. They don't rent Desert Eagles anymore (like it was the guns fault...). Part of the reason why the range at BGS gets as unsafe as it does, IMO, is because the employees (especially on weekends) are often slated to work 12 hr shifts back to back 9-9. Yet they're expected to safely run a range, operate the full sales-floor, be friendly and helpful, and observant. All of that oftentimes with two people in the whole store (next time you're there, count how many are doing what). If you ever take a close look at Bills North, there's nowhere for the employees to sit or to have an official break (if the classroom has a class). You cannot fully, realistically, expect employees who are wore down after double 12 hr shifts on a Sunday night at 8 pm, to watch the range with the same care that they started the day with at 9am. Those kinds of hours are as unsafe for the patrons safety as they are (reportedly) unbearable for the staff.

I know it's hard to get an employee's attention at times due to how busy they are at ANY gun store right now.

Bill's needs to:

1) Clean up the air in the range.
2) Have more staff on-hand working 8 hour shifts with a 1 hour unpaid lunch break (9 hour day) with an area for them to break in (plus 2 15 minute breaks paid.)
3) Hire several staff who are dedicated RSOs.

My feelings exactly.

You some sort of business competitor, or ex-employee of Bill's?

[tazdevil]

The Discharge happened last April, while the store was PACKED. They don't rent Desert Eagles anymore (like it was the guns fault...). Part of the reason why the range at BGS gets as unsafe as it does, IMO, is because the employees (especially on weekends) are often slated to work 12 hr shifts back to back 9-9. Yet they're expected to safely run a range, operate the full sales-floor, be friendly and helpful, and observant. All of that oftentimes with two people in the whole store (next time you're there, count how many are doing what). If you ever take a close look at Bills North, there's nowhere for the employees to sit or to have an official break (if the classroom has a class). You cannot fully, realistically, expect employees who are wore down after double 12 hr shifts on a Sunday night at 8 pm, to watch the range with the same care that they started the day with at 9am. Those kinds of hours are as unsafe for the patrons safety as they are (reportedly) unbearable for the staff.

Why not, the Hospitals around here expect much more from their employees, and mistakes are just as lethal there as well. I work rotating straight 10's (which means no allotment nor guarantee for any kind of break), either 7-5 or 1-11. Then go on call overnight, regardless of what happens there, back at it the next day. Weekends I'm on call, it's more like work straight from late Friday night to Monday morning, some sleep here and there (and we do get a bit stinky then too ).

[mnarguy556]

Don't own a business and I'm not a former employee, I am interested in the patron's safety. I have spent a lot of time at Bills, before getting fed up with constant breaches of safety at the range, more (presumably) loaded firearms waved at me and other people than I care to recount. Some trigger time every week isn't worth that risk to me. There is of course, something to be said for the fact that BGS is a public range, and cannot always control efficiently who uses the range. I've only had discussions with some of the employees while there who don't seem to always be the happiest with their jobs (Who is?) and they've told me all of this.

[XDM45]

You some sort of business competitor, or ex-employee of Bill's?

I'm neither.

I'm a gun owner who doesn't want to get shot by one of the rent-a-boomstick-crowd and be around anyone negligent with a firearm.

[xd ED]

The Discharge happened last April, while the store was PACKED. They don't rent Desert Eagles anymore (like it was the guns fault...). Part of the reason why the range at BGS gets as unsafe as it does, IMO, is because the employees (especially on weekends) are often slated to work 12 hr shifts back to back 9-9. Yet they're expected to safely run a range, operate the full sales-floor, be friendly and helpful, and observant. All of that oftentimes with two people in the whole store (next time you're there, count how many are doing what). If you ever take a close look at Bills North, there's nowhere for the employees to sit or to have an official break (if the classroom has a class). You cannot fully, realistically, expect employees who are wore down after double 12 hr shifts on a Sunday night at 8 pm, to watch the range with the same care that they started the day with at 9am. Those kinds of hours are as unsafe for the patrons safety as they are (reportedly) unbearable for the staff.

Why not, the Hospitals around here expect much more from their employees, and mistakes are just as lethal there as well. I work rotating straight 10's (which means no allotment nor guarantee for any kind of break), either 7-5 or 1-11. Then go on call overnight, regardless of what happens there, back at it the next day. Weekends I'm on call, it's more like work straight from late Friday night to Monday morning, some sleep here and there (and we do get a bit stinky then too ).

That's my thought as well. I have been stuck doing 12-16 hr days during emergencies, working with stuff of far greater hazard. 12+ hours retail duty is pretty standard fare for most small shop owners. Acting unsafe, or getting pissy with customers is not an option.
The problem with some Bill's employees, is ...some Bill's employees. At Bill's there are some great people, among the finest you could meet- selling and instructing in firearms.
But far too many are of a mindset that no one knows more than they do. They often consider themselves the smartest guy on the range, presumably because the are the youngest, and loudest of those present.

[Sorcerer]

You think Bills range air is bad go ahead and try Meto, it's no better. They all have to meet air standards.

[JohnGageMN]

You some sort of business competitor, or ex-employee of Bill's?

I'm neither.

I'm a gun owner who doesn't want to get shot by one of the rent-a-boomstick-crowd and be around anyone negligent with a firearm.

Guess you better go set up your own range on private land then.

Anytime you go to a range that the general public has access to you have the potential that there will be some douchebag around that needs adult supervision.