Constructive intent?

[codilly]

Was trying to trade for this for one of this listed items and was told no but then realized that was good cause it has a carbine buffer tube on it that easily accepts a stock. I am pretty sure this is a big no no and an ATF violation.
viewtopic.php?f=49&t=44868

[Evad]

I'm not any sort of an expert on pistol/carbines...but if the seller is the guy I think it is...he is well aware and it is perfectly legal.

[codilly]

So it is completely legit to have a buffer tube that accepts a stock in seconds? I was always told the opposite.

[173rdABN]

A stripped lower is neither a pistol or rifle until the appropriate buffer tube is installed for the first time. If you place a rifle or carbine buffer tube on a stripped lower, you are in constructive possession of an SBR. You must have a pistol buffer tube on the lower for it to be a pistol. Once a lower is a pistol, it can be changed to a rifle (since a rifle/carbine is 16"+ there is no NFA rule against it). But you can NOT change a rifle lower to a pistol lower and install anything shorter than a 16"+ upper, because once it is a rifle it must have a 16"+ barrel or else be stamped as an AOW (if you are using a pistol tube) or as a SBR (if you want to keep the stock and rifle tube).

Love, spikes tactical. Directly from them.

[codilly]

He pm'd me saying MN ATF said as long as it hasn't had a stock on it before it's ok, which I am sure they confused with the buffer tube as just being the stock as far as they are concerned.

[TTS]

The truth is somewhere between the extremes...

Here is a letter frm the ATF
http://www.jcweaponry.com/images/ar15/BB.JPG

ETA:
http://www.atf.gov/files/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2011-4.pdf

[codilly]

So pretty much if he has proof it's never been used as a rifle in any way and doesn't have any AR15's with a stock or have a stock that would work on the buffer tube?

[TTS]

So pretty much if he has proof it's never been used as a rifle in any way and doesn't have any AR15's with a stock or have a stock that would work on the buffer tube?

No he just can't have an extra stock that would go on the pistol... In close proximity... (I read that as on the property)

He doesn't need proof it has never been configured as a rifle, rather that the receiver was transferred as a pistol or other on 4473.

[jshuberg]

It's not constructive possession unless he owns both an AR15 pistol, with a rifle or carbine buffer tube installed, and a stock that that isn't a component of an existing firearm, and the pistol is capable of accepting that stock.

Having an AR15 pistol, with a rifle buffer tube, and an AR15 rifle with a stock is fine, as long as you don't have an "extra" stock that could be used on the pistol.

Make sense?

[Consummate]

As long as the pistol isn't stored or transported with a stock, it should be fine.

But remember how much you paid for this "legal advice".

[FJ540]

It's not constructive possession unless he owns both an AR15 pistol, with a rifle or carbine buffer tube installed, and a stock that that isn't a component of an existing firearm, and the pistol is capable of accepting that stock.

Having an AR15 pistol, with a rifle buffer tube, and an AR15 rifle with a stock is fine, as long as you don't have an "extra" stock that could be used on the pistol.

Make sense?

Owning components of a whole gun in this case is pretty tough to prosecute. You could reasonably be assembling another weapon which wasn't NFA regulated. They would have difficulty proving you ever assembled a SBR in violation of law.

Where constructive intent gets messy is when you have something like a full auto FCG and a gun that will readily accept it. No one's likely to execute a raid on your house for having the parts for a SBR. Now if you were drilling 3rd pin holes in AR lowers and just happened to have the auto sear parts lying around - that'd be a tough case to defend.

[Hmac]

"Constructive intent" is the boogeyman in the closet for those interested in NFA weapons. Has anyone ever seen any situations where an individual with NFA components was charged and prosecuted with "constructive intent"? For that matter, has anyone ever seen or heard of an ATF agent knocking on the door of someone's home for anything? Ever see an ATF agent at a shooting range checking weapons?

[JustPlainT]

It's legal as long as you don't have an extra stock that could fit it.

Of course, who's going to know if you do. The ATF doesn't monitor things like that.

The whole point of "constructive intent" is so that the ATF has something extra to add to the charges on people who are already on their radar. They serve the warrant, and "oh look at what we found!" sort of thing. That way if the original charge doesn't hold, they have something else to fall back on.

[codilly]

Well then...