Help debunking this.

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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby cobb on Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:33 pm

TTS wrote:Facts can be twisted, for instance:
100% of child births will lead to a death

Another proven fact, there is a 100% death rate among those that drink water, undisputed.

Don't remember the exact numbers, but years ago some anti's quoted the percentage of gun murders going down much more in percentages in cities/states that had stiff gun control laws, thus proving their facts that stiff gun control laws saves lives. Their facts where based on if there were 1000 murders per 100,000 in a strict gun control city/state and the murders decreased by 50%, that now would be only 500 per 100,000, a 50% improvement. Another state with loose gun control laws started out with 100 murders per 100,000 and went down only 25% to 75 murders per 100,000, that is only a 25% decrease in murders and the anti's support their claims with those numbers. Don't look at the 50% decrease is still equal to an end result of 500 murders per 100,000 and the 25% is equal to only 25 less murders per 100,000, the percentages is what they used supported their argument.
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby grimbeaver on Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:37 pm


No no, you need someone with artistic talent to do a similar image. No one reads anything on Facebook anymore, they just post images.
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby Rodentman on Fri Feb 28, 2014 5:59 pm

I read about a statistician who drowned in a lake with an average depth of 12".
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby Mn01r6 on Fri Feb 28, 2014 6:40 pm

In Minnesota, Unintentional Deaths you have to get to the 25-34 year old age range before unintentional firearm even shows up...but I agree, this doesn't make a pretty picture for facebook.

20 Leading Causes of Unintentional Injury Deaths,
2010, All Races, Both Sexes

1-4
1 10 Unintentional Suffocation
2 --- Unintentional Fire/burn
3 --- Unintentional MV Traffic
4 --- Unintentional Drowning
5 --- Unintentional Poisoning
6 --- Unintentional Struck by or Against



5-9
1 --- Unintentional MV Traffic
2 --- Unintentional Drowning
3 --- Unintentional Other Land Transport
4 --- Unintentional Other Spec., NECN
5 --- Unintentional Suffocation
6 --- Unintentional Unspecified



10-14
1 --- Unintentional MV Traffic
2 --- Unintentional Other Transport
3 --- Unintentional Fall
4 --- Unintentional Machinery
5 --- Unintentional Other Land Transport
6 --- Unintentional Other Spec., NECN
7 --- Unintentional Struck by or Against
8 --- Unintentional Suffocation

15-24
1 101 Unintentional MV Traffic
2 35 Unintentional Poisoning
3 --- Unintentional Drowning
4 --- Unintentional Other Land Transport
5 --- Unintentional Fire/burn
6 --- Unintentional Suffocation
7 --- Unintentional Fall
8 --- Unintentional Machinery
9 --- Unintentional Natural/ Environment
10 --- Unintentional Other Transport
11 --- Unintentional Pedestrian, Other
12 --- Unintentional Other Spec., classifiable
13 --- Unintentional Struck by or Against

25-34
1 69 Unintentional MV Traffic
2 65 Unintentional Poisoning
3 --- Unintentional Other Land Transport
4 --- Unintentional Drowning
5 --- Unintentional Fall
6 --- Unintentional Fire/burn
7 --- Unintentional Other Transport
8 --- Unintentional Suffocation
9 --- Unintentional Natural/ Environment
10 --- Unintentional Other Spec., classifiable
11 --- Unintentional Struck by or Against
12 --- Unintentional Firearm
13 --- Unintentional Machinery
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby gdubya on Fri Feb 28, 2014 6:51 pm

You are probably best off not to address it on facebook. Most people frequent facebook and post this kind of stuff for confirmation of their cognitive bias. No matter what you say, they and those inclined to believe them will never be convinced.

However, once you look at these objectively some of those are obvious. Of course having a gun in the home makes someone more likely to be killed by a gun. Otherwise they would be stabbed, or hit with a hammer, or pushed down the stairs, or strangled, or whatever by the person who wanted to kill them. Of course you will not see a lot of statistics of people being shot in self defense in a home, usually they run like hell when they realize the homeowner is armed or avoid them in the first place.

The suicide is perhaps the most interesting, and most difficult to analyse objectively, but statistics are easily available. Compare the US and S. Korea. In the US the leading means of suicide for young males is by gun. Suicide prevention activists here say that the reason for this is unnecessarily easy access to guns. In S. Korea, the leading means of suicide for young males is jumping from tall buildings. Suicide prevention activists there say the reason for that is unnecessarily easy access to upper floors of tall buildings. The suicide rates are fairly similar among young people are similar but overall rates are actually much higher in S. Korea where firearms access is much more restricted. Conversely, in rural China, most of the population has no access to guns or tall buildings, so the most common method of suicide is pesticide poisoning. The one thing they are right about, is that the availability of an assuredly lethal method of any kind deos correlate to an increase in suicides. Another of those obvious moments...if people have the means to easily kill themselves, more of them will succeed. Now, in any modern society there are going to be any number of means to kill oneself if one thinks hard enough about it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_co ... icide_rate
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 ... 8/abstract
http://www.who.int/bulletin/volumes/86/9/07-043489/en/

Unfortunately, it is far easier to make or post misleading cartoons on FB than it is to think critically, objectively, or logically.
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby JohnGageMN on Fri Feb 28, 2014 10:17 pm

Simplest response:

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics." - Mark Twain
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby farmerj on Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:36 am

Surprised no one included this one yet......


Rosie O'Donnell's spoon made her fat....
We reap what we sow. In our case, we have sown our government.
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby photogpat on Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:10 am

The firearm in the home statistics don't subtract out the criminals.

Obviously, if you're dealing meth/crack/etc, and you have a firearm in the home, your chances of being shot go up.

If you subtract out the criminals, the stats are near even.
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby LePetomane on Sat Mar 01, 2014 7:17 am

Marriage is also the leading cause of divorce.
Donald Trump got more fat women moving in one day than Michelle Obama did in eight years.
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby Scratch on Sat Mar 01, 2014 3:30 pm

Tell her that anybody can make up stats... even me!

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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby LePetomane on Sat Mar 01, 2014 4:20 pm

farmerj wrote:Rosie O'Donnell's spoon made her fat....


What made her ugly?
Donald Trump got more fat women moving in one day than Michelle Obama did in eight years.
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby JohnGageMN on Sun Mar 02, 2014 1:59 am

LePetomane wrote:
farmerj wrote:Rosie O'Donnell's spoon made her fat....


What made her ugly?


Genetics.
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby CarryCauseICan on Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:51 pm

Scratch wrote:Tell her that anybody can make up stats... even me!

CARTOON.jpg

Sweet Scratch! Can I use that?!
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Re: Help debunking this.

Postby Scratch on Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:14 pm

CarryCauseICan wrote:
Scratch wrote:Tell her that anybody can make up stats... even me!

CARTOON.jpg

Sweet Scratch! Can I use that?!


Feel free...
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