Minnesota Saturday Night Special Law

[Russstra]

Do I need to post my gun collection pics again? I'm confused. This law makes half my collection technically illegal. That's my point

[Squib Joe]

Greased pig contests are also illegal in Minnesota. So is growing Barberry bushes. There a lot of unenforced or scarcely enforced laws on the books. So make a stink and get them rewritten into something worse - that sounds like a good plan.

[Ghost]

There are much more important laws to fix such as

It is illegal to sleep naked

Oral sex is prohibited

http://www.dumblaws.com/laws/united-states/minnesota

[wasfuzz]

So is Criminal Syndicalim - and we do not see that enforced after a BLM "rally"

2016 Minnesota Statutes

185.06 POWER OF EXECUTIVE DEPARTMENT OR COURTS NOT CURTAILED UNDER CERTAIN CONDITIONS; CRIMINAL SYNDICALISM.

Nothing in sections 185.01 to 185.06 shall hamper or curtail, or in any manner take away, the power of the executive department, or of the courts, where there is threatened any irreparable injury to business or property by reason of violence, threats, or other unlawful acts, or where criminal syndicalism, or the acts constituting the same, are involved; and criminal syndicalism is hereby defined to be the doctrine which advocates crime, sabotage, violence, or other unlawful methods of terrorism as a means of accomplishing industrial, social, or political reform.

[unfitmother]

"Chess, not checkers" is a pretty well understood mantra for pro-2A folks here in MN, and it's what is expected of people who want to be involved in those politics.

When someone comes along and demands attention for an ego-centered issue, they are going to be challenged. If they don't engage in a constructive conversation, then they will likely be dismissed as not pro-2A.

That is what happened to Russstra. He had multiple opportunities to check his ego, but instead he doubled-down on stupid.

[FJ540]

I bought 5 pos pistols in preparation for the next gun buyback. I got $500 at the last one. I don't understand why any of you think I'm anti gun. You must have never been on the bad side of a bad law. We vacuum form ABS. We don't do injection. How many oz shot are you looking to do?

Not sure, but probably under 3 oz on the large side. I've been leaning towards two-part poly and silicone molds for ease of R&D, but if I knew someone with a press I could sneak on in a slow period, that might change things. Two-part isn't exactly cheap, but it is easy.

[FJ540]

"Chess, not checkers" is a pretty well understood mantra for pro-2A folks here in MN, and it's what is expected of people who want to be involved in those politics.

How many pawns have been taken out with this method? Where's the checkmate in your strategy?

It took 80 years to get suppressors legalized. You call that a winning game?

I'd rather play checkers. You have a winner in minutes not hours. I don't have another lifetime to wait for my rights that shouldn't have been taken in the first place.

[grimbeaver]

Do I need to post my gun collection pics again? I'm confused. This law makes half my collection technically illegal. That's my point

I think you've forgotten what the law says already. It only makes it illegal for an FFL to transfer one of them, which is not required for you to do a personal sale. Your possession of them is in no way illegal nor are you restricted from reselling them.

[2in2out]

Checkers or chess, you still have to think a few moves ahead. That's a key detail, and why I'm concerned that trying to get someone to enforce this will be counterproductive. I also don't think this is a pressing issue, although I agree that being proactive is generally a good idea.

If this really can't wait, if it really needs to be done now, then do it right. Trying to get someone to enforce this is counterproductive and selfish. Enforcement isn't the answer here. That's like saying your living room is colder than the kitchen, so you're going to light a fire on the floor.

If social justice must be done, and must be done right now, then write a new bill to replace the bad one and send it through the proper process. This takes persistence and indomitable spirit. Don't expect to succeed right away and don't give up. Chess is about expecting that your first few moves will fail and only by outsmarting your opponent will you prevail. There's no luck in chess. Nothing worth doing is easy.

What's amazing to me is that this entire conversation occurred because one person wants to take some government entities' money the next time there's a gun buyback.

The stupidity of others doesn't give everyone else a license to be equally stupid. Pro-firearms people of all kinds constantly insist that their cause is the righteous one, and they have an obligation to prove that every single day - that's the only way they can retain the right to claim how good they are. Prove it with actions, not words. Lead by example, not by being selfish.

There's no way to compare something like this with the efforts of 2015. I don't think there's a full appreciation for what happened, and it most certainly did not take 80 years for a talented group of people to accomplish what they did. That's not a statement grounded in fact.

The original topic of discussion is probably not a good law, but could be allowed to simmer for a long time. Many other problems could be solved in the meantime, and a choice has to be made about which ones to move froward and which ones wait. Rome wasn't built in a day.

Finally, one further thought. This entire discussion - besides being about one person's goal of making a rather small amount of money from a gun buyback program - is missing a much larger and much more critical issue. We are under a massive and constant attack from the media, Hollywood and many in government - what we would probably classify as the Ruling Class - they're ALL trying to make us look like crazies and misfits. They think they can ostracize us like smoking or super-sized cola. So, let's pick a law that's not being enforced correctly and try to get it enforced. Go ahead, make it worse for everyone! And, while we're distracted trying to hold on to, buy or sell guns that don't fit the definition of the law, they will be flanking us with a new assault on our rights that we didn't see coming.

We have an advantage right now to change hearts and minds, not just laws. The growth of trap teams in high schools, the acceleration of interest in carrying a handgun for self protection, an increase in positive coverage from alternative media... this is a rare opportunity to go on the offensive. Bickering about whether a poly frame turns into goo in a garage sale oven seems petty to me.

Chess is a prestigious game for a reason. It's hard to be good.

[FJ540]

Nobody wants it enforced but the anti's. So far it's anti's 1, 2A 0 on the subjective merits of what constitutes a dangerous weapon based on outdated information on manufacturing processes.

Why Russ wants the law changed is immaterial. He could be campaigning for affordable self defense options and it wouldn't change anything. You talk about smart moves and cohesion while criticizing the motives of another free man as not being righteous enough to matter. $250 profit off SNS buybacks might be a big deal to him. Who the hell are you to judge? And, he's consuming anti money and putting it in the pro-2A side of the economy, yet you don't see that as a good chess move?

Sorry, if that kind of narrow mindedness is your idea of a good way to win rights back, I'm on the wrong team.

The suppressor bill's time in process is not what's measured. The time the rights were taken is. No way to candy coat your victory there. If a trial lasted 2 months, but took 25 years to prosecute - that's a long fight even though it was a quick win.

[hard h2o]

I bought 5 pos pistols in preparation for the next gun buyback. I got $500 at the last one. I don't understand why any of you think I'm anti gun. You must have never been on the bad side of a bad law. We vacuum form ABS. We don't do injection. How many oz shot are you looking to do?

Thanks for the reply. I wish the organizations running those were a bit more transparent with their finances. They spend a lot of money and do not make a dent in the criminals ability to acquire firearms.

I am not sure yet if you are anti gun. I believe you are misguided in your attempt to get this law applied to a broader number of firearms.

[Russstra]

Look, I don't really care about making a few hundred bucks at the next gun buyback. It was just something I did on a whim. I didn't know this law existed until I had 5 guns of questionable manufacturer sitting at my FFL whom is skeptical to transfer them. I started the process to verify if they were legal or not and after speaking to the ATF and the Attorney General of Mn, found that nobody really knows. They recommended getting manufacturer specs to verify legality. There isn't a list that says what is and isn't legal. Only the language of the law. Well I realized that makes most modern pistols that are poly, magnesium, or aluminum illegal. I called the NRA and Mr. Cornish and after getting nowhere, came here. Where you all proceeded to call me an anti- troll.

[Russstra]

To further complicate things one manufacturer got back to me saying their frames are indeed zinc. However I tested it with a magnet and it's magnetic. Which zinc isn't.

[photogpat]

Why does this keep coming up?

Thermoset polymers decompose (aka BURN) prior to melting -- ie...they never reach LIQUIDUS (liquid) as specified in the law -- hence, don't fall under the definition of "Saturday Night Specials".

[Holland&Holland]

Do I need to post my gun collection pics again? I'm confused. This law makes half my collection technically illegal. That's my point

Just because you post pics of guns does not give an anonymous name on an internet forum credibility. Why not try to show up at some events. Become a member of the community. Then when folks know you and you know them you can see the best way to get folks to help you in your endeavors. Not certain anyone has ever had success coming into a room and stating "you are all doing it wrong, you need to do it my way" and getting folks to change. But then again, I am 100% convinced that you are an anti looking to research how this community would react to your pipe dream of broadening the application of this law.