Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby xd ED on Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:31 pm

http://www.mnguntalk.com/viewtopic.php?f=52&t=48919&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&hilit=NoDak&start=15#p505977

This is where the original topic of a thread drifted to this issue.

July 31, 2013
NEW CONCEALED WEAPON LAWS TAKE EFFECT AUGUST 1, 2013
BISMARCK, ND – The Legislature passed several bills that change the weapons and concealed weapons laws and as a result, beginning tomorrow, August 1, 2013, applicants for North Dakota’s concealed weapons licenses will notice several new procedures, announced Attorney General Wayne Stenehjem.
The application process has been streamlined and applications now will be mailed directly to the BCI instead of being submitted to the local law enforcement agencies. Other changes include:
• The application form has been shortened and can be downloaded and completed from the concealed weapons license page of the Attorney General’s website (http://www.ag.nd.gov).
• Additional fingerprint-based federal record and NICs checks will be conducted on all new and renewing applicants. The extra fees charged by the FBI for the federal record checks are included in the application processing fee, which increases from $45 to $60.
• Non-ND residents must have a valid concealed weapon license from their home state, which state must have reciprocity with North Dakota. The home state is determined by the driver’s license

• For a Class 1 license, the “look back” disqualifying time period for alcohol-related offenses is now limited to 10 years.
• Defense sprays and stun guns (but not Tasers) can be carried concealed without a concealed weapon license.
“The new comprehensive federal criminal record and mental health record check requirements have helped us keep reciprocity for Class 1 license holders with thirty-six states. The streamlined application process will be faster and easier for all applicants,” said Stenehjem.
New and renewal applications started after today must be submitted using the new form and procedures and the new $60 fee. The BCI will process current application forms that are delivered to local law enforcement today. The green forms are invalid beginning August 1. Applications not delivered to law enforcement today fall under the new laws, requiring the new form and processing fee. Applicants who completed testing in July will need to download and complete a new application form and mail both the new form and the old form (with the testing information) to the BCI, along with the $60 fee.
There are currently 27,219 North Dakota concealed weapons license holders.
Detailed information about the law changes, the new online application process, and a list of certified test administrators, is available online from the Attorney General’s website, at http://www.ag.nd.gov/BCI/CW/CW.htm.
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby gman1868 on Mon Aug 11, 2014 12:52 am

Thank you for the clarification, those darned legislators love to change things, don't they :)
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby Thunder71 on Mon Aug 11, 2014 1:50 pm

The "CCW" app I have says you can carry in ND with a MN permit and non-resident Florida permit, this site says the same:
http://www.usacarry.com/concealed_carry ... _maps.html

Not that either of those hold up in a court of law. :?

It's similar to FL's reciprocity with Arizona. Florida honors the AZ permit, but only if you have a residence there. So as a MN resident, you cannot carry in FL on an AZ permit if you don't live there.
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Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby xd ED on Mon Aug 11, 2014 3:18 pm

FLA has a nice business selling permits. With MN/ NoDak, it's 'let's see who can pee farther'.
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby LarryFlew on Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:04 pm

I'm carrying there today and its working fine ;-)
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby Hmac on Mon Aug 11, 2014 4:30 pm

LarryFlew wrote:I'm carrying there today and its working fine ;-)


Go wave your gun in front of a cop, then get back to us. I'd be curious to see how that goes for you. It would probably answer my question definitively.
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby xd ED on Mon Aug 11, 2014 6:06 pm

Thunder71 wrote:The "CCW" app I have says you can carry in ND with a MN permit and non-resident Florida permit, this site says the same:
http://www.usacarry.com/concealed_carry ... _maps.html

Not that either of those hold up in a court of law. :?

It's similar to FL's reciprocity with Arizona. Florida honors the AZ permit, but only if you have a residence there. So as a MN resident, you cannot carry in FL on an AZ permit if you don't live there.


Re the linked site: In the "RECENT CHANGES" list that goes back to July 2013, they do not have the NoDak changes relevant to this discussion which occurred, I believe, on 01 August 2013
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby Thunder71 on Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:18 am

I know, I'm just saying there's two popular sources saying you can - which is why I put neither will hold up in a court of law, it's up to each individual to know the laws of the state they are visiting - I always recommend handgunlaw.us first and foremost.
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby Holland&Holland on Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:16 am

Hmac wrote:
LarryFlew wrote:I'm carrying there today and its working fine ;-)


Go wave your gun in front of a cop, then get back to us. I'd be curious to see how that goes for you. It would probably answer my question definitively.


Um, I think if you wave your gun in front of a cop in any state it likely will not be a positive experience, but I get your point.
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Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby xd ED on Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:23 am

Thunder71 wrote:I know, I'm just saying there's two popular sources saying you can - which is why I put neither will hold up in a court of law, it's up to each individual to know the laws of the state they are visiting - I always recommend handgunlaw.us first and foremost.


I'd go with the states' Dept of Pubic Safety's, or Attorneys General's website for the state of concern. That's where these various websites/ apps are getting their info; and the states' published info might just have legal value.
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby Thunder71 on Tue Aug 12, 2014 10:30 am

Handgunlaw.us links directly to each states laws.

If someone were to go here:
http://www.ag.nd.gov/BCI/CW/reciprocity.htm

It would look like they could carry, without digging any further.
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Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby xd ED on Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:31 am

Thunder71 wrote:Handgunlaw.us links directly to each states laws.

If someone were to go here:
http://www.ag.nd.gov/BCI/CW/reciprocity.htm

It would look like they could carry, without digging any further.


Depends on who 'they' are. If they are a resident of a state that does not have reciprocity with NoDak (ie MN) then they cannot carry in No Dak, regardless of what permits they might hold. That's spelled out in at least 2 previously cited NoDak online sources.
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby Thunder71 on Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:12 pm

That's why I said if you just look at the linked page above at face value...

Example:
Hmmm, let's see if I can carry - MN permit, no... how about FL permit yes, great I'm covered with an FL permit.

I agree with what you're saying, I'm just expressing the importance of looking deeper (at the actual laws of each state), same as you. :D
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Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby xd ED on Tue Aug 12, 2014 12:20 pm

Thunder71 wrote:That's why I said if you just look at the linked page above at face value...

Example:
Hmmm, let's see if I can carry - MN permit, no... how about FL permit yes, great I'm covered with an FL permit.

I agree with what you're saying, I'm just expressing the importance of looking deeper (at the actual laws of each state), same as you. :D


I missed your inference. I hope North Dakota is the exception with their arcane law and ambiguous verbiage. As someone pointed out, at the source of their law is a kerfuffle regarding game bird hunting laws.
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Re: Minnesota resident - carry in North Dakota

Postby ex-LT on Tue Aug 12, 2014 1:23 pm

xd ED wrote:
Thunder71 wrote:Handgunlaw.us links directly to each states laws.

If someone were to go here:
http://www.ag.nd.gov/BCI/CW/reciprocity.htm

It would look like they could carry, without digging any further.


Depends on who 'they' are. If they are a resident of a state that does not have reciprocity with NoDak (ie MN) then they cannot carry in No Dak, regardless of what permits they might hold. That's spelled out in at least 2 previously cited NoDak online sources.

Not only can a MN resident not carry on an AZ/FL/TX/UT permit, because a MN permit isn't valid in ND, we can't even apply for a non-resident permit.

From the ND AG website...
If your driver’s license or identification card was issued in a state other than ND, you also will need to attach a copy of a valid concealed weapon license from your home state, which state must have reciprocity with ND


And from their permit application...
NON-ND RESIDENT Applicants only: Residency is determined by your state-issued license/identification card. If you are a resident of a state that has reciprocity with North Dakota, you must have a valid
concealed carry license from your home state and submit a copy with your application for a ND license. If your home state does not recognize non-resident licenses or does not have reciprocity with ND, you are
not eligible for a ND concealed weapon license
. Reciprocity information is available on the Concealed Weapon License page at http://www.ag.nd.gov.
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