How to begin? I am a total newbie

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How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby Being on Sat Nov 23, 2013 1:18 pm

Hi guys,
I came here today to ask you good people for help.
Consider me a total newbie to guns and gun laws. I want to purchase a hand gun and a hunting rifle. I am an adult, citizen, live in the TC area.

What are the steps involved (in order) ? (training, licensing, purchasing a gun, etc). How long does the training take, what else should I know about legally purchasing and keeping these for years to come.

Thank you
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby Hmac on Sat Nov 23, 2013 1:28 pm

I recommend a basic pistol course and basic rifle course so you can understand the various types of firearms. You will find the choices of firearm type, model, and caliber to be dizzying without guidance, and the advice you get on an internet gun forum will vary widely based on the poster's most recent favorite firearm. Check out various community colleges for courses, or check out the NRA's website. Alternatively, go into a gun store and ask about courses. Be careful about the advice you get on firearms at such a store. While it's not universally true, some of the most amazing misinformation possible can be had at your local gun store.

I wouldn't necessarily recommend starting with a permit-to-carry course, since you really don't even know what you will want to be carrying. Once you're confident in your understanding of the firearms options, you'll be able to buy one that is likely to suit you and your needs. THEN you can take a PTC course to learn the laws, and after that you can start taking defensive pistol courses so that you can learn how use a firearm to defend yourself.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby Seismic Sam on Sat Nov 23, 2013 1:46 pm

Well, thank you for asking the right question first!!

Buy this book: http://www.amazon.com/Concealed-Carry-Defense-Fundamentals-Edition/dp/1616582383 and read ALL of it carefully, and let the knowledge sink in for a while. re-read sections in the book as necessary.

This book is available at Bill's Gun Shops.

Don't know if you want to get a carry permit or not, but if you do there are plenty of people out there willing to train you. MN courses are 6 hours long, while Wisconsin courses are about half an hour long, and you learn very little, so take the MN course even if you live in Wisconsin. A LOT of the legal stuff gets covered in the MN course.

Rule #1: Beware of young Gun Store Tacticool sales people, and they will generally be more than glad to sell you whatever gets them the biggest commission and won't listen at all to your needs, if you know how to express them. They will also fill you full of BS about how gun X is the best thing ever made because they have one, and the stories get pretty amusing to us veterans who are standing by listening.

Rule #2: people in here know more than Tacticool pimply young gun salesmen for the most part, but we all have our own agenda and favorite brand of gun, and you can ask about Gun X and start a thread that turns into a running pissing match between gun owners for Brands X, Y, and Z. Sorry about that, but it happens.

Thankfully, Bill's Gun shops allow you to RENT an amazing variety of handguns, and you should ALWAYS TRY BEFORE YOU BUY!! This may cost you some money, but it's better to spend $250 up front for renting 5 guns than buying a $600 gun first and discovering that you hate it a few months later. This problem happens a LOT, so do not cheap out in trying one and buying it rather than comparing. You will regret it.

Some people in here will be glad to meet you at a local range end let you try their gun if you seem like a safe and conscientious person, but you should buy and pay for your own ammo at the very least!

So: Read the book, absorb the knowledge, think about it, and you can watch the BS flow by in here on various guns, and just remember we all have our own favorites and endless reasons why our choice is the best.

NEVER ask a gun counter employee about advice on handguns, including Bill's. Buy the book, window shop if you want, watch people shoot, and get the f*&k back out the door!!
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby gdubya on Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:20 pm

I will chime in, as all the above is good advice, but nobody really answered your original question.

MN has no licensing or registration or required training for a hunting rifle, show your ID, fill out the required forms, and if there are no issues from the NICS check, then you pay for it and it is yours. Sometimes NICS for whatever reason does not come back right away and you will have to put down a deposit and wait from an hour to a couple days and then pay in full when it comes in and you can pick up your rifle. Handgun is the same process except prior to purchase you will need to obtain a permit to purchase from your local police department or sheriffs office if you don't have a local PD. Once you get it in the mail, you can start the purchse process as above, and your PtP is good for one year.

That being said, all of the above is great advice. Apply for your PTP, then take a basic class and try some guns out to see what you like and shoot well and then you will be ready to buy once you find out.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby jdege on Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:39 pm

Best advice I'd ever heard for a new shooter was to buy a cheap .22 and a couple of thousand rounds of ammo.

Shoot through that, and then start to think about what sort of "real" gun you might want.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby Makarov on Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:47 pm

Since you mentioned "hunting" rifle.......
If you plan to actually go hunting with it:
DNR Firearms Certification is required of anyone born after December 31, 1979 to purchase a hunting license in Minnesota.
Info link below.
http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/safety/firearms/index.html

If the county you live in has a good website, you may be able to find the "ptp" permit to purchase a handgun form online, print it out, fill it out and turn it into your local county sheriff. They will take a photo copy of your MN DL.

or click BCA link below for the form to print:
https://dps.mn.gov/divisions/bca/bca-di ... armApp.pdf
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby Wiscosotan on Sat Nov 23, 2013 6:26 pm

If by "newbie" you mean that the "4 rules" don't mean anything to you and/or you've never shot at a public range (or possibly at all) before, then definitely take a basic firearms class first. I would suggest NRA Basic Pistol or the pistol fundamentals class at Bill's. That way, you learn the safety rules in a classroom environment, and your first trip out on a shooting range is with an instructor. After that, you will have more confidence in going to a gun store on your own or renting firearms and knowing how to handle them without causing a panic among the people around you. It will help you in knowing what questions to ask as well.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby LarryFlew on Sun Nov 24, 2013 1:26 pm

Hunting if what? Small game, big game and how big would help determine which rifle. Lot of different types of actions in both rifle and pistol. Rental and friends can help determine what is right for you there also. Coming to a function like a lunch or breakfast might also help. Lot of willing helpers here if you indicate what area you are in.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby LarryP on Sun Nov 24, 2013 6:25 pm

That book isn't very good IMO. Lacks local issues/laws



Seismic Sam wrote:Well, thank you for asking the right question first!!

Buy this book: http://www.amazon.com/Concealed-Carry-Defense-Fundamentals-Edition/dp/1616582383 and read ALL of it carefully, and let the knowledge sink in for a while. re-read sections in the book as necessary.

This book is available at Bill's Gun Shops.

Don't know if you want to get a carry permit or not, but if you do there are plenty of people out there willing to train you. MN courses are 6 hours long, while Wisconsin courses are about half an hour long, and you learn very little, so take the MN course even if you live in Wisconsin. A LOT of the legal stuff gets covered in the MN course.

Rule #1: Beware of young Gun Store Tacticool sales people, and they will generally be more than glad to sell you whatever gets them the biggest commission and won't listen at all to your needs, if you know how to express them. They will also fill you full of BS about how gun X is the best thing ever made because they have one, and the stories get pretty amusing to us veterans who are standing by listening.

Rule #2: people in here know more than Tacticool pimply young gun salesmen for the most part, but we all have our own agenda and favorite brand of gun, and you can ask about Gun X and start a thread that turns into a running pissing match between gun owners for Brands X, Y, and Z. Sorry about that, but it happens.

Thankfully, Bill's Gun shops allow you to RENT an amazing variety of handguns, and you should ALWAYS TRY BEFORE YOU BUY!! This may cost you some money, but it's better to spend $250 up front for renting 5 guns than buying a $600 gun first and discovering that you hate it a few months later. This problem happens a LOT, so do not cheap out in trying one and buying it rather than comparing. You will regret it.

Some people in here will be glad to meet you at a local range end let you try their gun if you seem like a safe and conscientious person, but you should buy and pay for your own ammo at the very least!

So: Read the book, absorb the knowledge, think about it, and you can watch the BS flow by in here on various guns, and just remember we all have our own favorites and endless reasons why our choice is the best.

NEVER ask a gun counter employee about advice on handguns, including Bill's. Buy the book, window shop if you want, watch people shoot, and get the f*&k back out the door!!
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby Hmac on Sun Nov 24, 2013 7:58 pm

LarryFlew wrote:Hunting if what? Small game, big game and how big would help determine which rifle.


Yeah, as to rifles, it all depends what the OP is hunting. Small game vs big game vs varmints will determine caliber. If he's not sure, I'd recommend getting a nice simple 10-22 Ruger, learn the iron sights, then slap on a simple 4x scope and learn that. Good way to learn the fundamentals of marksmanship, which will then carry over to whatever type of hunting he ends up aspiring to.

As to PTC courses, I wouldn't even consider taking one until he's taken a basic pistol course. There's no need, since even if he knew what kind of pistol to get, it would be unwise to be carrying a pistol until he know defensive pistol use beyond what's taught in a typical PTC course.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby Tronster on Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:18 am

As others suggested, take a basic firearms introduction course from an instructor to learn fundamental firearms safety and shooting skills.

Pistols in MN require a permit to purchase or permit to carry. A purchase permit is a form you fill out and submit to the local sheriff's office and they run an extensive background check, and after about a month if you pass you will receive a permit that is good for one year. There is no cost for a purchase permit. If you attend a permit to carry class (the costs vary depending on the instructor) you submit that training record to the sheriff with $100 fee and if they approve it you will receive a permit to carry that is good for 5 years. You can then carry a pistol for self defense outside of your property, and it doubles as a purchase permit. There is no registration or licensing requirement to own pistols or rifles/shotguns in the state of MN.

As far as rifles and shotguns, most of them you can buy with just your MN state drivers license and filling out a backgound check form at any gun dealer. They make a 10 minute phone call and if it passes you pay your money and walk out with a rifle or shotgun same day. But some long guns have certain features, such as common features found on an AR15, that require a purchase permit or carry permit before you can buy them.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby IDPA Shooter on Mon Nov 25, 2013 9:34 am

I'm surprised no one has mentioned it so far, so I will. In think Michael Martin's book is the best way to get started, http://www.amazon.com/Minnesota-Permit- ... arry+in+mn its well written, great illustrations and Mineesota specific and current. It is also
avaialble on Kindle and iPads I believe. Correction, I missed Sam 's earlier reference to a similar text by Michael Martin. This was is his MN state edition so it has MN specific info on laws, regs, etc.

Also, there are 50 + instructors on this forum with varying levels of experience, training and skills and all of approach it somewhat differently. Yes, most of us are NRA certified, but many of us teach a customized course. Another instructor, who is a collge professor, wrote this and I modified it somewhat to help new people select a trainer

http://rejfirearms.blogspot.com/2012/11 ... ainer.html

Your going decide what is valuable to you. For some its strictly cost, cause they know all they need or want to and just want the paperwork stamped or signed. For others they want police/military experience, others value the ability and desire to work with newbies and their experience doing basic or permit training. I had one person tell me my class sounded great, but they would go elsewhwere since I was 20 miles from their house and they only wanted to drive 15 minutes or less. YMMV, but a few dollars spent on getting reliable information from an experienced trainer who will support you after the class is money well spent. If its a permit class be sure they are well versed in the law, their mistakes, mis statements or gloss over of the law may mean some fines or time in the iron hotel for you.
Last edited by IDPA Shooter on Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby Spartan on Mon Nov 25, 2013 9:49 am

Locate one of the NRA instructors and take a couple classes.... I suggest taking the DNR Hunter/gun safety class. Its taught everywhere but I will recommend a few where there is some range shooting more than just the minimum requirement of the state. Don't get me wrong ... most of the classes are great and most of the instructors are outstanding..... but these offer extras in the way of shooting w/ coaching ...... Post 435, Post 550 and one in Scott county.....

Also: CMP (civilian marksmanship Program) has many affiliated local clubs..... find one ( its $10.00) and join. They hold clinics and weekly shoots ... but they usually have rental rifles and will give you instruction.

Appleseed program .... another option to learn.......

The truth is you need basic instruction and then like anything you need to keep learning ...... by the time you think you know it all ... PLEASE SELL ALL YOUR GUNS AND QUIT .... BECAUSE THEN YOU WILL BE EITHER A DEMOCRAT OR SENILE OR BOTH........
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby ninjedi on Mon Nov 25, 2013 11:04 am

Being wrote:Hi guys,
I came here today to ask you good people for help.
Consider me a total newbie to guns and gun laws. I want to purchase a hand gun and a hunting rifle. I am an adult, citizen, live in the TC area.

What are the steps involved (in order) ? (training, licensing, purchasing a gun, etc). How long does the training take, what else should I know about legally purchasing and keeping these for years to come.

Thank you


Most other suggestions here are jumping the gun (no pun intended).

First thing you need to determine is what will you be using them for? I.e., what are you hunting (birds, deer, bears, etc.) will dictate what kind of rifle you buy, and what you are using the handgun for (target shooting, personal defense, etc.) will dictate what kind of handgun you want to buy.

From there, you can proceed on making a purchase and training options.
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Re: How to begin? I am a total newbie

Postby grimbeaver on Mon Nov 25, 2013 3:22 pm

Good post ninjedi. I was wondering why the heck everyone was ranting on about getting a carry permit when he never even said he wants to carry. He wants a handgun and a hunting rifle. Based on what he said I'm going to guess most likely he plans to take both hunting and that's it.

But as others have suggested take a basic firearms safety courses. Most ranges either offer one or can direct you to where to take one. Then go from there based on what you learn.
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