New Generation of Shooters

[LumberZach]

My thoughts echo Bensdad’s. While I won’t go so far as calling the self important darling’s opinion garbage, I will say he needs to grow up. Too many of the “Millennial Generation” seem to think all they have to do is show up somewhere and when acceptance, respect and love isn’t showered upon them they get their delicate little feelings hurt.

I remember in my misspent youth, back when I knew everything, not being accepted by my father’s generation. The difference between then and now is I knew I had to earn their respect, it wasn't just going to be bestowed upon me.

While I don't disagree with you, I know how fast new shooters get turned off to the sport because of people like he described in the article. Respect has to be earned, but judgment does not need to be passed either direction.

[yukonjasper]

sort of falls in line with this thread in that it discusses how people who are not following the rules at the range should be treated.
http://www.mnguntalk.com/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=49353&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15

harshness and anger are not the way to get through to the newer generations. Like it or not, they don't respond to that sort of communication style. I'm not saying everyone needs to become a social worker or guidance counselor, I think its a matter of curbing your anger and not giving in to your need to emulate a Drill Instructor just to be able to get a point across. I also believe that not everyone posesses the skill to communicate at the level that would be pleasing and inviting to the everyone gets a trophy generation. The end result is both sides need to try to meet in the middle if they can - less crumudgeonly and gruff on one end and less thin skinned and willing to run away on the other.

IMHO, the presumption that someone who looks different from you isn't someone with whom you could have an intelligent exchange with, is unfortunate and limits a person in many many ways. There is always something that can be learned from anyone you meet, you just need to be open to the idea that its possible.

[Shipyard]

My thoughts echo Bensdad’s. While I won’t go so far as calling the self important darling’s opinion garbage, I will say he needs to grow up. Too many of the “Millennial Generation” seem to think all they have to do is show up somewhere and when acceptance, respect and love isn’t showered upon them they get their delicate little feelings hurt.

I remember in my misspent youth, back when I knew everything, not being accepted by my father’s generation. The difference between then and now is I knew I had to earn their respect, it wasn't just going to be bestowed upon me.

While I don't disagree with you, I know how fast new shooters get turned off to the sport because of people like he described in the article. Respect has to be earned, but judgment does not need to be passed either direction.

i'm confused on all this "respect" talk. you don't have to respect me. you don't have to kiss my ass or give me a hug. is it so much to ask that the older generation act like GENTLEMEN to younger shooters? (and vice versa but that's antoher thread - i'll conceed it goes both ways)

I've been in many a situation where someone my senior has talked rudely, been condesending or downright mean for absolutely no reason. When confronted, I have always responded with defference and courtesy to diffuse the situation. There has never been cause for such behavior - I can't know what another is thinking but many times I have concluded that an assumtion on the part of an "older gneration" has played a large role in the conflict.

I'm jsut lucky that i have a solid sense of self esteem and pay no attention to that kind of behavior - many others are not so lucky and are turned off from the sport/hobby/social rights support involving firearms and the losers are US ALL

is it REALLY such unique feature of our social contract within the gun community that there is virtually no room between "demanding respect" and "inconsiderate rudeness" for "basic politeness"?

Support gun rights - be nice to a punk kid with a gun today

IMHO, the presumption that someone who looks different from you isn't someone with whom you could have an intelligent exchange with, is unfortunate and limits a person in many many ways. There is always something that can be learned from anyone you meet, you just need to be open to the idea that its possible.

THIS IS 100% RIGHT ON

[Rip Van Winkle]

For the folks who had a problem with the article - is it just the tone of it / way it was put, or do you think he said something that doesn't describe reality?

Other than his description of the reasons the folks who replaced the Articles of Confederation with the Constitution wished to do so, the post looks pretty dead-on to me...

To me it's his "everyone must change to accommodate me" attitude. It's hard for me to take him seriously when he states the reasons he and his friends don't like the NRA is their prayer breakfasts and country music concerts.

As far as the attitude he says he and his girlfriend encountered, I've both seen and experienced it, it's nothing new.

Can we as gun owners do more to police our ranks for asshats? yep. Should we do more to encourage new shooters? yep.

I however suspect, if these new shooters the author is speaking of are so superficial they get so easily offended, they won't be in for the gun rights fight anyhow.

[Shipyard]

I however suspect, if these new shooters the author is speaking of are so superficial they get so easily offended, they won't be in for the gun rights fight anyhow.

you mean like the members here throwing Bills GS under the bus over getting stiffed 20 minutes and 20 miles worth of gas over a scheduling misunderstanding???

.... such easily offhanded dismissal of the next generation of gun brothers and sisters. sad really...

Not EVERYONE taking your places is going to be a clean cut fresh faced star quaterback prom queen railin' leave it to Beaver Eagle scout guys. ..

My point illustrated, time to go hibernate again.

All you other easily offended young whipper snappers, COD operators, athiests, gays and dirty dirty lib-tards who want to go shootin' give a shout - you know how to find me for some good times.

Added bonus: Anyone carying any kind of anti-gun rights membership or internet logon shoots for free with me - let's see if we can't revoke that status over a warm 45

[bensdad]

if anyones is this upset by the article - i'd ask you to think for about 20 minutes about WHY - you're probably exactly the type of person who inspired this article to be written. if you're feelign that challenged, i invite you to explore why...

Wow. You're right and i'm wrong. Guess I'll throw an acceptance parade for all of you who think your'e so special... Must be a generational thing. You kids all want a participation trophy.

I'll invite all of you who can't just belly up to the firing line without worrying about being loved and cherished by other shooters to take 20 minutes and explore why you need so much attention.

[bstrawse]

For the folks who had a problem with the article - is it just the tone of it / way it was put, or do you think he said something that doesn't describe reality?

Other than his description of the reasons the folks who replaced the Articles of Confederation with the Constitution wished to do so, the post looks pretty dead-on to me...

To me it's his "everyone must change to accommodate me" attitude. It's hard for me to take him seriously when he states the reasons he and his friends don't like the NRA is their prayer breakfasts and country music concerts.

As far as the attitude he says he and his girlfriend encountered, I've both seen and experienced it, it's nothing new.

Can we as gun owners do more to police our ranks for asshats? yep. Should we do more to encourage new shooters? yep.

I however suspect, if these new shooters the author is speaking of are so superficial they get so easily offended, they won't be in for the gun rights fight anyhow.

I'm about as hardcore of a guns rights person as you'll find - and the NRA's focus on prayer breakfasts and country music bugs me. There's a lot that they could do to be more inclusive.

So can alot of the local gun clubs and related organizations - but in time, they will.
b

[Rip Van Winkle]

I however suspect, if these new shooters the author is speaking of are so superficial they get so easily offended, they won't be in for the gun rights fight anyhow.

you mean like the members here throwing Bills GS under the bus over getting stiffed 20 minutes and 20 miles worth of gas over a scheduling misunderstanding???

.... such easily offhanded dismissal of the next generation of gun brothers and sisters. sad really...

Not EVERYONE taking your places is going to be a clean cut fresh faced star quaterback prom queen railin' leave it to Beaver Eagle scout guys. ..

My point illustrated, time to go hibernate again.

All you other easily offended young whipper snappers, COD operators, athiests, gays and dirty dirty lib-tards who want to go shootin' give a shout - you know how to find me for some good times.

Added bonus: Anyone carying any kind of anti-gun rights membership or internet logon shoots for free with me - let's see if we can't revoke that status over a warm 45

I'm not exactly sure how you equate any of that to what I said, but far from me to stand in the way of a good internet rant.

[Rip Van Winkle]

I'm about as hardcore of a guns rights person as you'll find - and the NRA's focus on prayer breakfasts and country music bugs me.

I'm not going to go out of my way to attend either one, but I'm curious, why does it bug you?

ETA: How do you think the NRA can or needs to be more inclusive?

Just curious.

[adam21584]

I am 30 most would consider old school I am not a entitlement type of person I earn the respect I have received through hard work. I work have worked with mostly older than me. I dress normal, am a mechanic/welder and get odd looks stopping at the store on the way home from work from people wondering why I am so dirty. I was complimented on my tan in the middle of winter (dirt tan). I don't need anyone's acceptance, I work hard and for the most part people my age and younger wouldn't and couldn't do what I do. The punk style is fine but you will be judged by it. When I see someone dressing like that covered in tattoo's and needing to borrow money is my problem Ink isn't free and artists don't work for free. Some are normal hard working people, some get a pay check and cannot make it till the following paycheck with anything. That is just the way some people think And it could be anyone, Dressing any way Respect needs to be earned not given out. They can be pro gun or not on the street I will judge them, Seeing them acting safely and responsibly at the range will be a good first step to earning respect.

[crbutler]

In a way after reading that article I can "sort of" see the point.

We don't want our inherent prejudices to cause us to prejudge someone who we have a similar belief stance with, but don't know it.

However, the fact remains that regardless of how much you "support gun rights" if you vote for folks who have a pretty much negative gun rights record regardless, you are not for gun rights (you may not be anti gun, but you are not FOR gun rights) and it has been shown that the NRA is not a GOP organ. Heck, I think they will select a pro gun democrat over a slightly more pro gun republican to prove it.

I will admit that I have met some tatted up, dirty, pierced folks who are good people, similarly, I have met some "god fearing" clean cut worthless SOB's... but stereotypes exist for a reason, and if you don't want to be stereotyped, don't act that way. I will also note that most of the folks who exclaim "don't judge me on my looks" and look like some fringe type usually are exactly what they look like, they just don't want you to treat them like "that." Face it, people like to socialize with folks they feel are similar to them, and if you are making no effort to make the other guy comfortable, then don't be surprised when they don't want to associate with you.

As to the NRA, most of the stuff that goes on at the convention is aimed at making money. I too could give a damn about a prayer breakfast or a country concert. I expect the majority of NRA members don't, but enough do and want to pay to go to them that the NRA does it. Somehow, I really doubt that they would make $0.50 if they had a Fifty Cent concert. As long as you don't get offended by the other guy, why do they care (answer is they are just as bigoted as the people they are objecting to, if not more.)

And I am Gen X if that matters at all (it shouldn't)

[Erud]

If you choose to look weird, people will treat you like you're weird. It's the way the world has always worked.

Life is already hard. If people want to make it harder on themselves, who am I to get in the way. Go ahead and let your freak flags fly, just don't get all butt-hurt when everyone else doesn't recognize you for the beautiful, special butterflies that you are.


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[Pat Cannon]

harshness and anger are not the way to get through to the newer generations. Like it or not, they don't respond to that sort of communication style.

This is true as far as it goes, except I've noticed that old farts don't like being yelled at either. The one time I remember the RO at Bill's have to break up a yelling match over a safety violation, it was two fiftyish guys butting heads.

[goatroper]

Here is another article from American Handgunner magazine titled "Unlikely Allies" that is also on this subject. Author goes by the name John Connor.
http://americanhandgunner.com/unlikely-allies/

[Countryfried Frank]

Why is everyone getting their underbritches in a twist about country music and prayer breakfasts. If the goal is a more inclusive NRA they should be maintained to continue to include their traditional base. If someone feels left out because someone else went to a prayer breakfast I'm betting they can find another thing to feel left out about too. Oh, and the last time I checked Uncle Ted was a pretty big figure in the NRA and The Nuge doesn't really strike me as the country music/prayer breakfast type. Anyone who wants to go crabbing about prayer breakfasts and big tents without even a nod to Ted Nugent is either blind, foolish, ignorant or trying to be deceptive.