"Saturday Night Special" Law

Gun related chat that doesn't fit in another forum

Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby Ghost on Wed Feb 11, 2015 10:15 am

maddhunter wrote:Yes I tried to order the Chiappa's in the past and was unable to do so.
PSA had the Colt/Walther Gold Cup Model on sale for $229.00 plus $8.50 shipping! Now you can feel my pain.

I saw that and considered buying another. Guess it's good I didn't try. At the time I bought mine you weren't getting them for that. I remember going to gander lakeville and putting 1050 rounds through it the week after Newtown to break it in. It's worth what I paid for it, my only regret was burning through my 22 ammo fort unknowing of what was coming. They are probably cheaper now since you still can't readily buy ammo for them.
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby cgrant26 on Sat Feb 14, 2015 12:48 am

DonT wrote:The sure way to get the correct answer is to send an email to the local ATF branch. I have always found them to be quick (usually within a day or two, which to me is reasonable) to respond and very professional. I have done this on a number of occasion and found them very helpful.

Then you will have your answer directly from the "Horses Mouth" to take to the FFL or to notify the seller.

Don

No. That is not the correct answer.

The Saturday Night Special law is a state law, not a federal law. ATF has nothing to do with state laws.

EDIT:

Someone already covered it.
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby djont57 on Sat Feb 14, 2015 7:37 am

Is there a list of all guns that are not legal in MN? Or is it safe to assume that any gun with an alloy frame is illegal? I would really like a cheap plinker.
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby Lights on Sat Feb 14, 2015 9:57 am

Ok so let's get some things straight here. Just because a receiver is cast does not mean it's "pot metal". I am a Moldmaker and you can cast S7, SS, Aluminum etc. The next thing is I helped build the original Henry receiver molds when they were reintroduced back in like 1999 They were and still are molded/made from Zamak 3. Which has a melting point of 725 degrees. I believe the Ruger 10/22 is also made from the same material. Plus you can get a Ruger 10/22 in a pistol version. So what makes it ok to sell these guns with a receiver material melting point of 725 degrees and to band the others that I bet are made from the same Zamak 3 material?
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby yuppiejr on Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:34 am

The 10/22 receiver is made of A380 aluminum with a liquidus melting point of 1100 degrees F (above the law's threshhold of 1000), not Zamak 3 which melts at 700-750 F.
Last edited by yuppiejr on Sat Feb 14, 2015 11:12 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby yuppiejr on Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:39 am

djont57 wrote:Is there a list of all guns that are not legal in MN? Or is it safe to assume that any gun with an alloy frame is illegal? I would really like a cheap plinker.


Just to clarify, the alloys in question with a low melting point sometimes used in less expensive rimfire firearms are typically Zinc (Zamak 3 as mentioned by the guy 2 posts back). Aluminum alloys are also a common material used in firearm construction with a much higher melting point to which the SNS laws to not apply, AR15 + Ruger 10/22 receivers, CZ75 PCR/P01 frames, etc.. The issue is not with all "alloy frames" - it's specific metal alloys (usually Zamak 3) with a low melting point.

Hi Point uses Zamak 3 extensively on their pistols in low stress components (receiver, slide, frame) while the barrel/chamber and various pins/components that require more strength are steel. However, the SNS law seems to indicate these should be illegal yet they get sold at gun shows and pawn shops all over the place in this state:

Saturday night special pistol. "Saturday night special pistol" means a pistol other than an antique firearm or a pistol for which the propelling force is carbon dioxide, air or other vapor, or children's pop guns or toys, having a frame, barrel, cylinder, slide or breechblock:

(1) of any material having a melting point (liquidus) of less than 1,000 degrees Fahrenheit, or
(2) of any material having an ultimate tensile strength of less than 55,000 pounds per square inch, or
(3) of any powdered metal having a density of less than 7.5 grams per cubic centimeter.

Umarex (owner of Walther) OEM's a lot of inexpensive rimfire lookalike pistols modeled after popular models in their and other brand's centerfire lineup using Zinc Zamak frames and other components including the Walther P22 + PPK/S + PPQ .22, Colt 1911/A1 .22 LR, Sig Mosquito, etc.. Many of the original GSG rimfire guns also use zinc alloy components that are on the MN SNS "list", in particular many of the early MP5 look alikes. Since most of these have frames or slides made of Zamak 3 they are all within the MN SNS definition of a SNS though I can't think of a local gun shop I've visited that didn't have one or more examples of these guns or a few Hi-Point's in the display cases for sale (new and used).

624.716 SATURDAY NIGHT SPECIALS PROHIBITED; PENALTY.

Any federally licensed firearms dealer who sells a Saturday night special pistol, or any person who manufactures or assembles a Saturday night special pistol in whole or in part, shall be guilty of a gross misdemeanor.
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby grimbeaver on Sat Feb 14, 2015 4:05 pm

Just curious anyone know or ever heard of anyone actually getting charged with violating the Saturday Night Special? There is no list of banned guns and manufacturer's don't publish specifications on their guns which would allow someone to validate if it meets law so it seems like it would be rather difficult for the state to prosecute someone under it.
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby MaryB on Sat Feb 14, 2015 8:25 pm

Sounds like a law we need to have repealed because it is hopelessly outdated.
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby Ghost on Sat Feb 14, 2015 8:38 pm

MaryB wrote:Sounds like a law we need to have repealed because it is hopelessly outdated.

And mostly un-enforced
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby Deputyhiro on Sat Feb 14, 2015 8:49 pm

What about polymer AR lower receivers?
It is better to have a gun and not need it, than to need a gun and not have it.
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby Lights on Sat Feb 14, 2015 10:26 pm

Deputyhiro wrote:What about polymer AR lower receivers?


Or polymer pistol frames?
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Re: "Saturday Night Special" Law

Postby LarryFlew on Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:29 am

Read this from the begining
I wondered why the frisby kept getting bigger and bigger - and then it hit me.
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