Keeping Firearm in RV?

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Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby sprigfan on Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:48 pm

Fully understanding that an internet forum does not equate to legal advice:

The wife and I plan to buy our first travel trailer this winter, which leads me to wonder about the legality of storing firearms in RV's.

Does MN law treat RV's more like a dwelling or a vehicle? If I have a carry permit and my wife does not, can she be left alone with the firearm in the camper, or would this technically be considered carrying without a permit?

As we all know, we cannot drink while carrying. What if we drink while camping, and the gun is left in the camper? Is this treated the same as drinking at your own home?
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby photogpat on Thu Jan 11, 2018 1:50 pm

Nothing to see here. Continue swimming.
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby BigBlue on Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:24 pm

sprigfan wrote:As we all know, we cannot drink while carrying. What if we drink while camping, and the gun is left in the camper? Is this treated the same as drinking at your own home?


Your assertion does not match MN carry law.
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby INOR on Thu Jan 11, 2018 2:50 pm

Based on my read, I think it really depends on whether the travel trailer is hooked up or parked. If it's hooked up, it's being actively transported or at least capable of being actively transported, so in MN, they'd treat it the same as the tow vehicle. In that case, you'd want to be cased and unloaded unless you had a carry permit in which case you could be uncased and loaded unless you yourself were "loaded" and in that case, you'd need to be "cased and unloaded while you're loaded." A bigger issue if you were "loaded" while hooked up to the RV would be whether an officer also thought you were driving or had intent to drive while loaded. Not a good thing. Bottom line, to be safe, if the RV was in a condition to be towed, I would make sure I was sober and the gun was stowed properly unless I had a valid carry permit.

If it's unhooked and parked, then it's not a "vehicle" in my opinion since it can not independently transport itself, so home rules should apply. But, a motorhome is a different animal altogether since it's always a vehicle. I would guess it really depends on whether it's currently capable of active transport. If it's set up, hooked to power and water, slides out, and jacks down, it's clearly not mobile.

But I'm no lawyer. Just a simpleton tax geek.
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Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby sprigfan on Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:03 pm

BigBlue,

Are you saying we are allowed to consume alcohol and carry at the same time?

In my carry class we were told you cannot legally carry if you have been drinking at all, unless you are at home.
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby ex-LT on Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:14 pm

sprigfan wrote:BigBlue,

Are you saying we are allowed to consume alcohol and carry at the same time?

In my carry class we were told you cannot legally carry if you have been drinking at all, unless you are at home.

You were told wrong. IIRC, if your BAC is under .04, you're OK.
That said, it isn't terribly difficult to hit the .04 threshold.
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby BigBlue on Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:19 pm

sprigfan wrote:BigBlue,

Are you saying we are allowed to consume alcohol and carry at the same time?

In my carry class we were told you cannot legally carry if you have been drinking at all, unless you are at home.


I'm sure an instructor or someone more versed in carry law will be along, but my understanding of it (from 3 prior carry classes and much observed discussion over the years) is that you are OK to drink until you ready 0.04 BAC.

The following links reference the same:

https://liberty-lawyer.com/gunsandfirearms/carrypermitmn/
http://mnpersonalsafetytraining.com/index.cfm/pageid/29

Obviously gauging your BAC level is impossible and I'm not advocating specifically carrying when you intend to hit the bar, but the intent was that you could be out for dinner and have a beer and not run afoul of the law.

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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby sprigfan on Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:22 pm

ex-LT wrote:
sprigfan wrote:BigBlue,

Are you saying we are allowed to consume alcohol and carry at the same time?

In my carry class we were told you cannot legally carry if you have been drinking at all, unless you are at home.

You were told wrong. IIRC, if your BAC is under .04, you're OK.
That said, it isn't terribly difficult to hit the .04 threshold.
Ok so that's where I got mixed up. For all practical purposes, .04 is about 1 beer for the average person.
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby BigBlue on Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:26 pm

sprigfan wrote:Ok so that's where I got mixed up. For all practical purposes, .04 is about 1 beer for the average person.


BAC is quite variable for folks. But I highly doubt 1 beer would get the average adult male to 0.04. That would imply that 2 would get them to 0.08 and that is even less convincing to me. I have seen various BAC police-sponsored drinking test examples over the years and even smaller ladies take more than 2 drinks to get to 0.08.

Again, don't confuse my pushback for advocating drinking while carrying. Sensible folks would avoid the combination. But know that there is some wiggle room and the law is not "no drinking while carrying". I think this is one of those frequently mis-understood aspects of the carry law, along with thinking concealment is required. Suggested, not mandated.

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Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby sprigfan on Thu Jan 11, 2018 3:38 pm

Fair enough.

For the sake of my original question, let's assume it is definitely over .04.

Is a parked, unhitched RV treated more as a dwelling or vehicle?
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby ttousi on Thu Jan 11, 2018 4:00 pm

in no particular order
* an RV unhitched is not a motor vehicle by MN definition (no motor). therefore a structure
* wife alone in RV with no permit firearm needs to be unloaded and cased
* .04 BAC while carrying ...conviction means loss of permit for 6 months.....2nd offense or greater than .1 conviction is loss of permit for year
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby LarryFlew on Fri Jan 12, 2018 12:18 am

ttousi wrote:in no particular order
* an RV unhitched is not a motor vehicle by MN definition (no motor). therefore a structure
* wife alone in RV with no permit firearm needs to be unloaded and cased
* .04 BAC while carrying ...conviction means loss of permit for 6 months.....2nd offense or greater than .1 conviction is loss of permit for year


Keeping in mind that as your "home" number 2 still requires either permission or reason to enter by police etc. Covers most state laws BTW.
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby ttousi on Fri Jan 12, 2018 5:34 am

LarryFlew wrote:
ttousi wrote:in no particular order
* an RV unhitched is not a motor vehicle by MN definition (no motor). therefore a structure
* wife alone in RV with no permit firearm needs to be unloaded and cased
* .04 BAC while carrying ...conviction means loss of permit for 6 months.....2nd offense or greater than .1 conviction is loss of permit for year


Keeping in mind that as your "home" number 2 still requires either permission or reason to enter by police etc. Covers most state laws BTW.


true......depends on usage at the time
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby LarryFlew on Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:19 pm

Not so much a real legal issue but we have stayed at MANY parks and have yet to see one that does not have some kind of firearms statement. Most say no firearms allowed and a few say firearms must be cased etc. Note the size of a "few" as that means 2 so far.

falls under the same stuff as concealed is concealed as far as I am concerned. Yes the extras in my RV are cased etc but the carry is available no matter what the park rules are. If needed for defense I can deal with the park rules after the problem is taken care of.
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Re: Keeping Firearm in RV?

Postby Holland&Holland on Fri Jan 12, 2018 2:42 pm

Why not have the wife get her permit? Having a permit does not require you to carry. Do you ever run into the post office? Do you unload and case it at that time? What if you have a heart attack or other medical emergency while traveling? I suppose you could have them call the local law enforcement agency to confiscate it while you are incapacitated, or she could have her permit and take possession of it.

Not trying to be a jack ass, at least not this time, but something to think about.
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