Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby Pinnacle on Tue Jan 11, 2011 3:33 pm

Dick Unger wrote:
Pinnacle wrote:
carver952 wrote:He was able to buy a handgun in November because AZ does an instant background check at the time of purchase.
People at the community college had reported his behavior, but he was not on any watch list or warrants,
he had no gross-misdemeanors or felonies, so the check came back clean.
He went to walmart and bought 100 rounds of FMJ, to fill 3 magazines (31 or 33)


It is not about clearing the NICS check, not about buying a gun, ability to buy the gun, eligibility to own a gun, it is about people ignoring a pattern of behavior, reports of his behavior being dead ended with people thinking that it is not their problem, or responsibility, and a lack of awareness of the problem.

If you get booted out of school because you are scaring people, it is not enough to just toss him out of school. People need to know, people need to act and take these problems seriously. Would intervention when someone knew he was "off" have helped? Perhaps, it would have been better than any intervention that was tried with this character in the past.

Set the access to guns agenda asides and look more closely at the CORE ISSUE / mental health problems, awareness and intervention.



Pinnacle nailed it.

It appears that his school teachers and counselors were very familier with his illogical behavior. Their response? Kick him out, send him down the street. Exactly what will increaase his frustration, and they should be trained to know that. He was a textbook case of mentally ill; probably could be easily handled with some meds. But nobody will blame THEM for sending a dangerous guy away, instead, they'll blame the clerk at the gunstore for not stopping this.


Dick since you agree with me, I am changing my position 180 degrees.......
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby PileDriver on Tue Jan 11, 2011 8:23 pm

I like how the supposed in-touch-with-people-and-their-feelings are obsessed over inanimate objects and trying to blame people who had nothing to do with this... and we, the hateful/angry/bloodthirsty gunslingers are questioning why no one tried to get the guy some help when all the signs were there. Truly interesting.
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby photogpat on Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:27 pm

I spoke to several people in MNSCU (Minnesota Small Colleges and Universities) about how suspected mental illness is handled. The overwhelming answer?

Punt. Make it someone else's problem.
Nothing to see here. Continue swimming.
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby Pinnacle on Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:40 am

photogpat wrote:I spoke to several people in MNSCU (Minnesota Small Colleges and Universities) about how suspected mental illness is handled. The overwhelming answer?

Punt. Make it someone else's problem.



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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby DanM on Wed Jan 12, 2011 6:55 am

photogpat wrote:I spoke to several people in MNSCU (Minnesota Small State Colleges and Universities) about how suspected mental illness is handled. The overwhelming answer?

Punt. Make it someone else's problem.



fixed it for ya
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby photogpat on Wed Jan 12, 2011 7:45 am

Shoulda put quotes around 'small' -- they have 'small' University syndrome!
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby 911scanner on Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:17 am

hammAR wrote:Jumping into an unknown situation, even the professionals screw up once in a while..................

Baltimore officer was killed by fellow officers
By BEN NUCKOLS, Associated Press

BALTIMORE – Baltimore police say that fellow officers fired the gun shots that killed a plainclothes officer during a melee outside a nightclub.
.
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Officer William Torbit Jr. was on duty in plainclothes when he responded to a report of trouble at the club. Police spokesman Anthony Guglielmi (goo-lee-EHL-mee) says Torbit was trying to break up a fight when he was attacked and pulled out his weapon to defend himself.
.
.
Read More:


Ummm.... ya, you're right Hammar. A bit off the original topic, but I'm sure you remember Duy Ngo? http://www.tcdailyplanet.net/blog-entry ... y-ngo.html
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby Ranger01 on Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:34 am

photogpat wrote:I spoke to several people in MNSCU (Minnesota Small Colleges and Universities) about how suspected mental illness is handled. The overwhelming answer?

Punt. Make it someone else's problem.


We had a paranoid-schizophrenic guy in our class. Noone was even comfortable being around him. He really went off the handle and was threatening people and harrassing one of the female students. But we could not get rid of him. The only action the instructors could take (other than to yell at him) was to talk to the higher ups, and he was still around last time I was there.
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby carver952 on Wed Jan 12, 2011 11:40 am

photogpat wrote:He really went off the handle and was threatening people and harrassing one of the female students.
But we could not get rid of him. The only action the instructors could take (other than to yell at him) was to talk to the higher ups, and he was still around last time I was there.

Threatening people is a crime: 5th degree assault (609.224) or disorderly conduct (609.72),
depending on the specifics (i.e. I will kick your butt vs I'm going to stab you with my blade)
this should have been enough for police to hold this guy, even if only 3 days.
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby Ranger01 on Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:29 pm

carver952 wrote:
photogpat wrote:He really went off the handle and was threatening people and harrassing one of the female students.
But we could not get rid of him. The only action the instructors could take (other than to yell at him) was to talk to the higher ups, and he was still around last time I was there.

Threatening people is a crime: 5th degree assault (609.224) or disorderly conduct (609.72),
depending on the specifics (i.e. I will kick your butt vs I'm going to stab you with my blade)
this should have been enough for police to hold this guy, even if only 3 days.


Yea, we probably should have followed up on it, but after he got yelled at by the instructor he stayed away from other ppl for a while. Also we had heard that he was getting the boot anyways for lack of academic effort... didn't happen.

On a side note, we did figure out (through him yelling at himself about it) that he had been convicted of assault a few years prior for beating the crap out of a co-worker. So this type of thing might not be so unusual for him.
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby macphisto on Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:33 pm

tman wrote:There has been some whining on the Left over Palin's use of crosshairs in some "targeting" ads.

I give you this, which is purported to be from the DNC, circa 2004. Don't hear much about it now..n but those look like BULLSEYES to me.

Image

I don't see the names of individual politicians on there; that's very different from Palin's map. Not that I think Palin, Beck, Rush, or anybody else but the shooter is responsible for what happened.
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby nyffman on Wed Jan 12, 2011 12:54 pm

macphisto wrote:I don't see the names of individual politicians on there; that's very different from Palin's map. Not that I think Palin, Beck, Rush, or anybody else but the shooter is responsible for what happened.
That's very perceptive of you.
He did not watch TV. He disliked the news. He didn’t listen to political radio. He didn’t take sides. He wasn’t on the left. He wasn’t on the right.

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/jar ... ews_b48040
our quarrel is not about the value of freedom per se, but stems from our opinion of our fellow men … a man’s admiration of absolute government is proportionate to the contempt he feels for those around him --Alexis de Tocqueville--
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby Pinnacle on Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:04 pm

Sometimes there is no reason for what happens other than well, mental illness. We all would like to point the finger of blame at someone, or something for setting him off.

Mental illness set him off. Let's leave it at that.

As for Duy Ngo, I would avoid that topic alltogether. Nobody would want to speak ill of the dead.
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby hammAR on Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:17 pm

Pinnacle wrote:Sometimes there is no reason for what happens other than well...............................


Well the fact is that in the big wide world out there that there are evil, nasty people that will kill, dismember and torture for a variety of reasons....
call it mental illness, genetics, heredity, religion, cultism, culture, IQ, nature vs nurture, or whatever you want,
but understand that it is there and there is not a damn thing that you can do about it............
except protect yourself and loved ones........
All men are created equal....It's what they do from there that matters!.
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Re: Rep. Gabrielle Giffords shot in AZ

Postby macphisto on Wed Jan 12, 2011 1:23 pm

nyffman wrote:
macphisto wrote:I don't see the names of individual politicians on there; that's very different from Palin's map. Not that I think Palin, Beck, Rush, or anybody else but the shooter is responsible for what happened.
That's very perceptive of you.
He did not watch TV. He disliked the news. He didn’t listen to political radio. He didn’t take sides. He wasn’t on the left. He wasn’t on the right.

http://www.mediabistro.com/tvnewser/jar ... ews_b48040

What are you trying to convince me of? I was just sayin' it's kind of a weak comparison.
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