Police volley of lead produces one hit

[Lumpy]

NYC Police fire 84 shots at suspect, 83 miss:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/nyp ... be51bbb978

[Ghost]

I'm going to blame the 12lb trigger pull

[linksep]

All I keep thinking is "I'm the only one in this room professional enough to carry a Glock .40".

All the anti-2A LEOs (and many/most anti-2A civilians) use that "argument".

(Not saying all LEOs are anti-2A or that that even a meaningful number of LEOs are this inept at handling firearms... just commenting on the "argument" that all LEOs are perfectly safe and all civilians are more dangerous than a monkey driving a truck full of armed nuclear warheads.)

[Citiot]

I read through many of the responses on the link and didn't see anyone mention that NY "civilians" are restricted to magazines holding 10 rounds. Cops (understandable) have a low hit rate.

NY Cops (even retired cops aka citizens) can carry magazine with 17 rounds. This means that a cop's life is worth 17/10ths more than a civilian.

Much like a black soldier in the civil war was initially paid 10/13th the pay of a white soldier ($10/mth - black soldier, $13/mth - white soldier)

A little off topic, for some odd reason, whenever I hear about arbitrary magazine capacity numbers, I think of Monte Python and the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch. In my mind, I picture idiot law makers arguing what the capacity should be....."... and the number of the 'clip' capacity shall be 7, and 7 shall be the counting of the capacity, not 8, not 6 excepting proceeding to 8..." Hope I'm not being too strange:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOrgLj9lOwk

[jshuberg]

Police are citizens. They are civilians. They are no different in any way from any other member of the population. They just happen to work for a political subdivision.


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[Rip Van Winkle]

I'm going to blame the 12lb trigger pull

I blame "Spray & Pray" training or the lack thereof.

[Ghost]

I'm going to blame the 12lb trigger pull

I blame "Spray & Pray" training or the lack thereof.

After re-reading, blame may be a bit strong. I should have said that the mandatory 12lb trigger pull doesn't help them.

[BigBlue]

"He fired at them, and they fired back," NYPD Deputy Commissioner Stephen Davistold the New York Daily News. "That’s when he was hit."

Other phrases the commissioner should have chosen:

"Eventually he was hit."
"Surprisingly, he was hit."
"Miraculously he was hit."
"Unexpectedly, he was hit."

[farmerj]

.......snip.......

A little off topic, for some odd reason, whenever I hear about arbitrary magazine capacity numbers, I think of Monte Python and the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch. In my mind, I picture idiot law makers arguing what the capacity should be....."... and the number of the 'clip' capacity shall be 7, and 7 shall be the counting of the capacity, not 8, not 6 excepting proceeding to 8..." Hope I'm not being too strange:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xOrgLj9lOwk

9 is right out.......

[tman]

Police are citizens. They are civilians. They are no different in any way from any other member of the population. They just happen to work for a political subdivision.


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It is acceptable to compare "police" and "civilians" in this context.

My opinion, of course, backed by singe definitions, somewhere.

[jshuberg]

Civilian is derived from the phrase "civil law". It literally means "civil law-ian". It identifies the set of laws a person is subject to. The opposite in this context is military law, which in modern times is the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ).

Any person who is not subject to the UCMJ is a civilian. Police officers, not being subject to military law, are civilians. The term has nothing to do with who a person works for, or what their job duties entail, or whether they wear a uniform or not.


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[Pat Cannon]

I wonder if this is like the firing-squad syndrome where a particular executioner deliberately misses because he doesn't want to be the one who kills a person, but feels confident that somebody will kill him, so it won't make any difference. I've read that there was at least one awful, messy non-execution for this reason.

It's not too hard to imagine a cop thinking, "I'm not sure why we're shooting at this guy, but if everybody else is shooting at him, I suppose I should shoot at him too."

[LarryP]

Now we know why the gov't buys more ammo than they are supposed to

[shooter115]

I'm going to blame the 12lb trigger pull

I blame "Spray & Pray" training or the lack thereof.

Pretty much this. Back when I was involved with our local police and sheriff departments training and qualifications, it was obvious who the gun guys were. The few that weren't gun guys and didn't train, target shoot, shoot competitively or hunt would struggle with basic courses much more than those that did. I would assume in NYC there is a much, much lower percentage of officers that actually shoot than you would find out here in rural MN.

[tman]

Civilian is derived from the phrase "civil law". It literally means "civil law-ian". It identifies the set of laws a person is subject to. The opposite in this context is military law, which in modern times is the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ).

Any person who is not subject to the UCMJ is a civilian. Police officers, not being subject to military law, are civilians. The term has nothing to do with who a person works for, or what their job duties entail, or whether they wear a uniform or not.


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Thanks for the etymology lesson. Here's the Webster dictionary's definition:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/civilian

Full Definition of CIVILIAN


1

: a specialist in Roman or modern civil law


2

a : one not on active duty in the armed services or not on a police or firefighting force