Minneapolis: A case of murder? Or self-defense?

[nyffman]

I think the story could have been reported better, but is this a case where the castle doctrine could have helped clarify things?

[Fast351]

Not enough info in the story to determine. As usual, only the people there know the truth. Bet that police report with witness statements from the others there was interesting.

[gunflint]

So far, this one doesn't pass the smell test. We'll see.

[BRIT_in_the_weeds]

UMMMMMMMMMM, no mention of a carry permit.

[justaguy]

Or why he left the scene?

The guy has some ******* luck being shot twice for no reason.

[ttousi]

Or why he left the scene?

The guy has some ******* luck being shot twice for no reason.

Well I believe I read he was gonna take a shower before calling in...............evidence disposal??

[BRIT_in_the_weeds]

Those mean evil cops, arresting and charging him.It was self defense. Lets jump all over the prosecutors office for being misguided by the police.

BWANE WOOZ at it's best.

[chunkstyle]

I posted on "some other forum":

I'm pretty sure if he were a permit holder, it would have come out almost immediately. So, I doubt he will dodge the weapons charge. (Gross mis?)

However, there were 4 attackers. He just shot the most aggressive one. He didn't fire any follow-up shots, either, indicating his intent was to stop an attack, not commit one.

1) Likely he was in fear of GBH. Was his fear reasonable?

2) Would lesser force have worked? Simply brandishing the gun might have worked, and indeed, that might have been tried. After all, it was a .44 Magnum. That big ol' muzzle can be powerfully intimidating.

3) From the account, he did try to retreat.

4) From the account, he was an unwilling participant.

Apparently, the shooter has no serious record. I'd like to see the tox results on the deceased.

Sure sounds like a "drunken frat boys decide to kick the ass of a townie, and get a surprise" story, but there's usually twists.

[justaguy]

Good luck to the guy.

[cobb]

A court document said Lessley was 6 feet away from Claar when he fired two shots.

Interesting, no weapon and he shot him at 6 feet.

[justaguy]

And the fact that he left the scene of a crime isn't.

[Aceq2jot]

Good luck to the guy.

First off he was leaving a scene of an accident, as he claims which is not a good thing to do in any matter. There was no mention of road rage etc or anything to cause him to walk away in the first place. I would like to know the justifiable reason to why he would not swap information like a regular law abidding citizen??? There was no reason for him to leave the scene of the accident.

feared for his life, relatives say.

I am glad his family are speaking for him, not him.

Lessley's family claims racial epithets were shouted and punches thrown.

Well lets see, any time i have had to move on a person of colour the first thing they claim is racial discrimination or harassment. I have had many years of dealing with people of colour and they always call the race card as it is a built in defence mechanism

As Lessley stumbled to the ground, he pulled out a .44 caliber Smith and Wesson handgun and fatally shot Claar in the chest

He was not walking right and fell down on his own accord No one layed a finger, on him he fell on his own

So basically what i hear from the permit holders is that if your scared and walk back and trip, it is fine to shoot some one and claim self defense

My god we should all practice this paranoia and shoot anyone who looks at us wrong as we are in fear of our lifes We really need to practice this and teach this when teaching classes, as it is ok if a female feels scared to shoot some one, and they should be innocent to be scared

"He carried a gun because he was afraid to go out unprotected," she said.

A court document said Lessley was 6 feet away from Claar when he fired two shots.

And we must tell people it is not a crime to walk away from an accident as the law is wrong

[GregM]

Very disorganized and patchy report. Lots of hearsay and very few facts.

Plenty of witnesses, though. This should make an interesting court case.

[CueBall]

first of all, i would like to say i feel sorry for everyone that was involved families, for they are the true losers in the unfortunate incident. that being said i think it is safe to say that there is just not enough information at this time to make any type of informed opinion on this. i imagine there probably wont be until it goes to trial due to the severity of the of the charges and the hotbed topic that is "self defense".

My take on this issue is that it will hopefully give more of an idea of WHEN it is lawful to use deadly force and what constitutes the ability to retreat.

Having or not having a permit to me is really not relevant as is leaving the scene as they will be addressed in seperate charges i am sure, especially if they cant make the murder charge stick.

Again, while i am a ccw holder and will protect myself and my family to the best of my ability i understand those that are left behind end up having to pick up the pieces of someones foolish actions, and that goes both ways.

[Aceq2jot]

Very disorganized and patchy report. Lots of hearsay and very few facts.

Plenty of witnesses, though. This should make an interesting court case.

And as it was downtown i am sure there is plenty of video footage of the event. Especially the ones that belong to the city over in the warehouse district.