GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby XDM45 on Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:25 am

I think darkwolf45 makes some good points, as do some others on here. It's not going to be solved solely online, there is a double standard, we do need to pick and choose our battles, etc. I think GOCRA and the gun community handled it the right way when gun control legislation was trying to be shoved down our throats earlier this year. I also think that we are climbing uphill and any sort of a loss is huge for us. We have to fight for so little ground then fight harder to keep it, and all it takes is one idiot and we lose so much because negativity spreads so much faster than anything positive does. It's not right. It's not fair. It is what it is. I don't think that going to this anti-freedom rally is a good idea on any level.

As for free speech.... I think people get confused on that.

You are free to say whatever you like, just know that you are responsible for them and will be held accountable for them as well. Free speech is not freedom to say whatever you like without responsibility for your words without repercussions; free speech is the right to be responsible for your words that you say.
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby 45Badger on Wed Jul 31, 2013 5:45 pm

bensdad wrote:
Billy-Bub, mall ninjas, camo dudes, and tea party freaks


Wow. With friends like this... :(

Sorry Badger, we can't all be polo-shirt-wearin', board-meeting-havin', soccer mom's husbands.


More friend and intelligently (and heavily) invested in our joint 2A rights than you might imagine. If you're going to quote me, please do it completely and in context. There is a huge difference between the polo shirt crowd and smelly bubbas. Inside that difference there is plenty of room for good old fashion normal folks to show up and not scare the heck out of active voters. It's common sense.
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby bensdad on Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:41 pm

45Badger wrote:
bensdad wrote:
Billy-Bub, mall ninjas, camo dudes, and tea party freaks


Wow. With friends like this... :(

Sorry Badger, we can't all be polo-shirt-wearin', board-meeting-havin', soccer mom's husbands.


More friend and intelligently (and heavily) invested in our joint 2A rights than you might imagine. If you're going to quote me, please do it completely and in context. There is a huge difference between the polo shirt crowd and smelly bubbas. Inside that difference there is plenty of room for good old fashion normal folks to show up and not scare the heck out of active voters. It's common sense.


You insulted people by describing them negatively. You answered my criticism by following it up with added insult. Nice play.

This state has, what, about 130,000 carry permit holders? Maybe 1.5 million gun owners? And this board manages to hang on to a couple dozen regular posters? While you're breaking your arm off patting yourself on the back for all the wonderful advocacy you've done, think about the numbers a bit. I bet every person who reads this post knows at least a couple guys who have come here, sampled the fare, and left in short order. I know of four myself.

And you know darn well you could have made your point without using negative stereotypes and insulting descriptions.
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby river_boater on Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:45 pm

I have to agree. I recall one post in the past about attending some rally indicating leave your "Polaris Jacket" at home.
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby Lights on Wed Jul 31, 2013 9:50 pm

45Badger your location description has much to say about your rantings. Commenting on someone choice of clothes is just like making a racist comment. keep it to your self please.

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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby tenmilmag on Wed Jul 31, 2013 10:45 pm

Lights wrote:45Badger your location description has much to say about your rantings. Commenting on someone choice of clothes is just like making a racist comment. keep it to your self please.

45Badger Posts: 2738 [View]Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:03 pmLocation: Chanhassen, land of soccer moms in expensive cars


Get wit da times fellas. 45badger has moved out of state.
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby CraigJS on Thu Aug 01, 2013 4:02 am

Lights, " Commenting on someone choice of clothes is just like making a racist comment." NOT EVEN CLOSE !
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby 45Badger on Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:34 am

Lights wrote:45Badger your location description has much to say about your rantings. Commenting on someone choice of clothes is just like making a racist comment. keep it to your self please.

45Badger Posts: 2738 [View]Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:03 pmLocation: Chanhassen, land of soccer moms in expensive cars


Sorry for the confusion. My location comment was a fun poke at my family's vehicle choices (older pick up truck and minivan) not fitting in with the beepers and audis. To further explain, I have lived a very rural lifestyle for last 20 years or so and Chanhassen was a bit of suburban shock.

We just moved to Illinois (ugh, but it pays the bills) and my location comment on Illinois Carry is " west of the cesspool".

Back on topic- How we show up matters. I bathe pretty regularly and have a wardrobe that ranges from slob to business formal. When I show up in public representing anything but my sleepy Saturday morning self, I dress appropriately for the occasion. As Mr. Vroom noted one chilly Saturday morning, I looked like a tactical lumberjack 8-)

And again, the voters who matter do not typically identify with the stereotypical gunnie that gets the media /camera attention. Anybody care to take a wild guess at why the TV cameras so often find the smelly scruffy camo dude mall ninjas in the crowd?
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby bstrawse on Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:07 am

45Badger wrote:
Lights wrote:45Badger your location description has much to say about your rantings. Commenting on someone choice of clothes is just like making a racist comment. keep it to your self please.

45Badger Posts: 2738 [View]Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:03 pmLocation: Chanhassen, land of soccer moms in expensive cars


Sorry for the confusion. My location comment was a fun poke at my family's vehicle choices (older pick up truck and minivan) not fitting in with the beepers and audis. To further explain, I have lived a very rural lifestyle for last 20 years or so and Chanhassen was a bit of suburban shock.

We just moved to Illinois (ugh, but it pays the bills) and my location comment on Illinois Carry is " west of the cesspool".

Back on topic- How we show up matters. I bathe pretty regularly and have a wardrobe that ranges from slob to business formal. When I show up in public representing anything but my sleepy Saturday morning self, I dress appropriately for the occasion. As Mr. Vroom noted one chilly Saturday morning, I looked like a tactical lumberjack 8-)

And again, the voters who matter do not typically identify with the stereotypical gunnie that gets the media /camera attention. Anybody care to take a wild guess at why the TV cameras so often find the smelly scruffy camo dude mall ninjas in the crowd?


Well said.

I saw this firsthand at the Capitol this year during the gun control hearings in the MN House & Senate. The press went right to the leaders of Protect Minnesota - who were dressed in business dress and had their talking points down... and then they went right to the guy sitting upfront in camo w/ the blaze orange cap -- even though the leaders of GOCRA and the state lobbyist for the NRA were nearby.

Deliberate? Most likely.
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby Mn01r6 on Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:29 am

If you want to persuade the undecided people to side with you, you need to show them that you are no different than they are. We may all put our pants on 1 leg at a time, but the brain is capable of showing outgroup bias for very subtle reasons. Showing up in anything other than your Sunday's best means people will think less of you and think less of 2a supporters in general. That's just the way the world works.

Think of it this way: at a gun rally, we are almost interviewing for a job. The job is "can you be trusted to be safe with firearms" and just like in a real job interview, how you dress will have a large impact on how others think of you.

Based on looks/dress in these two pictures alone, who do you think the uninformed public would trust more with a gun:

Image
Massad Ayoob .... or

Image
James Holmes
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby Heffay on Thu Aug 01, 2013 7:34 am

Mn01r6 wrote:If you want to persuade the undecided people to side with you, you need to show them that you are no different than they are. We may all put our pants on 1 leg at a time, but the brain is capable of showing outgroup bias for very subtle reasons. Showing up in anything other than your Sunday's best means people will think less of you and think less of 2a supporters in general. That's just the way the world works.

Think of it this way: at a gun rally, we are almost interviewing for a job. The job is "can you be trusted to be safe with firearms" and just like in a real job interview, how you dress will have a large impact on how others think of you.

Based on looks alone, who do you think the uninformed public would trust more with a gun:

Massad Ayoob .... or

James Holmes


This. This this this, so many times this. Despite some people seeming to think that how they act/dress is their own business and doesn't reflect on anyone else, that's not reality. If you're going to represent someone, represent them well. Wearing a coat and tie is FAR more effective than 5.11 pants, an NRA hat and this:

Image
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GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby Snowgun on Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:53 am

5.11 pants are stylish, i tuck my dress shirt into them all the time!

To add to badger's points, what kind of styles and images do people associate with hippies, greenpeace, etc? Imagine if they always showed up with suits on, it would be much more difficult to portray them as crackpots.
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby grousemaster on Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:53 am

How is anyone supposed to recognize me as an operator without the pants and NRA hat?
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby Heffay on Thu Aug 01, 2013 8:54 am

Snowgun wrote:5.11 pants are stylish, i tuck my dress shirt into them all the time!

To add to badger's points, what kind of styles and images do people associate with hippies, greenpeace, etc? Imagine if they always showed up with suits on, it would be much more difficult to portray them as crackpots.


I've always said that pot would have been legalized 20 years ago if those damn hippies put on a suit and cut their hair. ;-)
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Re: GOCRA RECOMMENDS AVOIDING BLOOMBERG BUS EVENT.

Postby photogpat on Thu Aug 01, 2013 9:01 am

No one ever said Public Relations and the Media were fair...I wore a nice sportcoat khaki combination when I was at the Capitol this spring...
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