STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

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STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby jdege on Mon Nov 01, 2021 6:19 am

https://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2021/10/stephen-hunter-the-shooting.php
STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING
Something like this must have happened to Baldwin. The actor, as reported, was sitting in the pew of the church, practicing. He was trying mightily to get the draw-cock rhythm down and that was his focus, though dangerously adding the element of speed. It never occurred to him that the gun was loaded. (Rule No. 1: All guns are always loaded.) He was unaware that his muzzle had drifted onto the camera crew where Ms. Hutchins and director Joel Souza were crouched. (Rule No. 2: Never let your muzzle cover anything you aren’t willing to destroy.)

In practicing the draw-while-cocking integration, his index finger had wandered onto the trigger, depressing it just far enough to bypass the cocking function. (Rule No. 3: Don’t touch the trigger until you’re ready to shoot.) Struggling awkwardly, he released the hammer under the impression he had cocked the pistol. He hadn’t. The hammer flew forward. The gun fired. (Rule No. 4: Always know what your target is.) It is quite possible that absent knowledge of these mechanics, he still believes the gun fired on its own, out of some defect. The defect was his.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby Holland&Holland on Mon Nov 01, 2021 6:33 am

Wasn’t it in filming with a gun called out as a cold gun? In what film are the laws of gun safety ever observed?
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby jdege on Mon Nov 01, 2021 6:41 am

Holland&Holland wrote:Wasn’t it in filming with a gun called out as a cold gun? In what film are the laws of gun safety ever observed?

In all of them, where the production team insists upon it.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby Erud on Mon Nov 01, 2021 8:46 am

jdege wrote:
Holland&Holland wrote:Wasn’t it in filming with a gun called out as a cold gun? In what film are the laws of gun safety ever observed?

In all of them, where the production team insists upon it.


Not really. You can't film a movie where people are supposed to be shooting each other without them breaking all of those rules. For the most part, the 4 rules of firearms safety are only known and understood by people who own guns. People who aren't "gun people" generally don't know them, and can't realistically be expected to. Hand a gun to someone who has never handled one before and they will immediately break all 4, because they don't know any better. Alec Baldwin is a total arrogant prick, but I don't really think that this can be blamed on him. The lady in charge of the prop guns on this set is a different story.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby LarryFlew on Mon Nov 01, 2021 12:07 pm

Erud wrote:Not really. You can't film a movie where people are supposed to be shooting each other without them breaking all of those rules. For the most part, the 4 rules of firearms safety are only known and understood by people who own guns. People who aren't "gun people" generally don't know them, and can't realistically be expected to. Hand a gun to someone who has never handled one before and they will immediately break all 4, because they don't know any better. Alec Baldwin is a total arrogant prick, but I don't really think that this can be blamed on him. The lady in charge of the prop guns on this set is a different story.


And a very major part of the problem making SO MANY non-gun people afraid of guns and wanting to ban guns, When I was a kid I can't remember any guy and very few gals that where not taught the basics at an early age, If everyone could be taught that and be around guns for even a short while we would not have all of the gun control fanatics we have today.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby Holland&Holland on Mon Nov 01, 2021 12:22 pm

Erud wrote:
jdege wrote:
Holland&Holland wrote:Wasn’t it in filming with a gun called out as a cold gun? In what film are the laws of gun safety ever observed?

In all of them, where the production team insists upon it.


Not really. You can't film a movie where people are supposed to be shooting each other without them breaking all of those rules. For the most part, the 4 rules of firearms safety are only known and understood by people who own guns. People who aren't "gun people" generally don't know them, and can't realistically be expected to. Hand a gun to someone who has never handled one before and they will immediately break all 4, because they don't know any better. Alec Baldwin is a total arrogant prick, but I don't really think that this can be blamed on him. The lady in charge of the prop guns on this set is a different story.

Exactly
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby Holland&Holland on Mon Nov 01, 2021 12:23 pm

jdege wrote:
Holland&Holland wrote:Wasn’t it in filming with a gun called out as a cold gun? In what film are the laws of gun safety ever observed?

In all of them, where the production team insists upon it.

Then you have never watched a movie that contains a gun.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby yukonjasper on Mon Nov 01, 2021 12:29 pm

As much as I'd love to pound on Baldwin, he's a mindless stooge. Actors and actresses are vapid, self centered children who are barely able to manage their completely out of touch lives. He should be held accountable, but won't be. The woman in charge of the props and the people who handled the gun are going to fry. There is a real business opportunity for an ex-military or LEO to open a business that provides the knowledge and discipline to handling munitions on these movie and TV sets. I know they exist, but, evidently, the insurance company didn't insist that they prove the Production company hire one. If the Production company and everyone connected to this ******* get sues, the insurance companies will have to take notice and insist on hiring a qualified professional. I hate lawsuits, but that's how things get changed.

I agree that there are many things that should lead to arrests. I'm not ignorant enough to think it will happen. They would have been better off hiring a 16 year old that just finished hunter safety........
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby Erud on Mon Nov 01, 2021 1:19 pm

LarryFlew wrote:
Erud wrote:Not really. You can't film a movie where people are supposed to be shooting each other without them breaking all of those rules. For the most part, the 4 rules of firearms safety are only known and understood by people who own guns. People who aren't "gun people" generally don't know them, and can't realistically be expected to. Hand a gun to someone who has never handled one before and they will immediately break all 4, because they don't know any better. Alec Baldwin is a total arrogant prick, but I don't really think that this can be blamed on him. The lady in charge of the prop guns on this set is a different story.


And a very major part of the problem making SO MANY non-gun people afraid of guns and wanting to ban guns, When I was a kid I can't remember any guy and very few gals that where not taught the basics at an early age, If everyone could be taught that and be around guns for even a short while we would not have all of the gun control fanatics we have today.


Unfortunately, that's not the way it is anymore.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby Jackpine Savage on Mon Nov 01, 2021 1:27 pm

If the stupid, arrogant prick had spent an hour learning about the gun he was handling, he could have taken ten seconds and verified that it was unloaded.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby xd ED on Mon Nov 01, 2021 2:04 pm

Jackpine Savage wrote:If the stupid, arrogant prick had spent an hour learning about the gun he was handling, he could have taken ten seconds and verified that it was unloaded.



I agree. The stupid, arrogant prick has been a professional actor, staring in, and capitalizing off many violent action films involving firearms, much of time handling the firearms himself, for the better part of half a century. Maybe I give him too much credit, but I'm guessing he was better versed on other hazards of a film set...driving stunts, explosives, etc.
It is inconceivable to me that in that span of time he would not have come to recognize safe practices.

I also heard - albeit from a 3rd party - Armed American Radio - that there was 'target practice/ plinking taking place near the set by the production crew....
the set of which Baldwin was functioning as director.
Whether his acts of omission/ commission rise to actionable criminal behavior, morally, he is in this up to his eyeballs.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby jdege on Mon Nov 01, 2021 6:58 pm

Erud wrote:
jdege wrote:
Holland&Holland wrote:Wasn’t it in filming with a gun called out as a cold gun? In what film are the laws of gun safety ever observed?

In all of them, where the production team insists upon it.


Not really. You can't film a movie where people are supposed to be shooting each other without them breaking all of those rules.


MILES training breaks all the rules - which is why when a unit is using MILES the weapons are fitted with blank adapters and there are no live rounds on site.

Visible blank adapters would not work on a movie set, but snap caps would. There should not have been any live rounds accessible to be loaded into the gun.

And despite all that, Baldwin should have checked the gun when he picked it up.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby Erud on Mon Nov 01, 2021 7:59 pm

Ok. Go back and read through the 4 rules of gun safety in the article you posted, and explain how they could possibly be followed during the filming of a movie that depicts people shooting each other. I’m not arguing whether or not everyone should know the 4 rules and follow them like they’re carved into stone (we already know that they don’t, and they aren’t), I’m asking how they could be followed in that scenario. Alec Baldwin likely doesn’t know anything about guns, and I’m pretty confident that he doesn’t care enough to learn anything about them. He doesn’t care what the 4 rules are. He’s a dopey actor. If an “expert” hands him a gun and tells him it’s unloaded and safe, his silly ass thinks it’s unloaded and safe. People only know what they know. This all seems very simple and basic to us, but we are the kind of guys who hang around in gun forums. Most people aren’t.
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Re: STEPHEN HUNTER: THE SHOOTING

Postby yukonjasper on Mon Nov 01, 2021 10:07 pm

Baldwin is not an action hero and i don't think he has worked much or at all with guns during his career. No excuse, but he is definitely not even a pretend gun guy.
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