State's 'Ghost Gun' Law heard by MN Supreme Court

[xd ED]

Ghost guns ban law weighed by Minnesota Supreme Court - MN FOX9 News

The Anoka County Case

The case stems from a single vehicle rollover in Anoka County where Logan Vagle was criminally charged after troopers found a Glock 19 pistol without a serial number, which Vagle called a ghost gun.

A district judge in Anoka County ruled the law was unconstitutionally vague,

An appeals court reversed that decision, but defense Attorney Anders Erickson appealed to the Minnesota Supreme Court.

Erickson also pointed to discrepancies in state and federal law, including that federal law does not require serial numbers on privately made firearms or older guns manufactured prior to 1968.

"Looking at the plain language, if this court says every firearm in Minnesota is required to have a serial number then everyone that is in possession of a firearm that was manufactured before 1968 that does not have a serial number is committing a felony," Vagle’s defense attorney Anders Erickson told the justices on Wednesday.

Prosecutors maintain the language of the state law is clear.

"Anyone who receives or possesses a firearm that is not identified by a serial number is guilty of a crime," Assistant Anoka County Attorney Kelsey Kelly told the justices during oral arguments.

Prosecutors maintain Minnesota law regarding ghost guns is allowed to be more restrictive than the federal law.

"Anyone who reads [the statute] knows what is prohibited in the state of Minnesota," Kelly said.

Hopefully some sanity will return, and anyone on this board who might have inherited a couple of old shotguns from their grandfather could rest easier knowing they are no longer the felon they became....

[jdege]

609.667 FIREARMS; REMOVAL OR ALTERATION OF SERIAL NUMBER.

Whoever commits any of the following acts may be sentenced to imprisonment for not more than five years or to payment of a fine of not more than $10,000, or both:

(1) obliterates, removes, changes, or alters the serial number or other identification of a firearm;

(2) receives or possesses a firearm, the serial number or other identification of which has been obliterated, removed, changed, or altered; or

(3) receives or possesses a firearm that is not identified by a serial number.

As used in this section, "serial number or other identification" means the serial number and other information required under United States Code, title 26, section 5842, for the identification of firearms

26 U.S.C. § 5842 - U.S. Code - Unannotated Title 26. Internal Revenue Code § 5842. Identification of firearms

(a) Identification of firearms other than destructive devices.--Each manufacturer and importer and anyone making a firearm shall identify each firearm, other than a destructive device, manufactured, imported, or made by a serial number which may not be readily removed, obliterated, or altered, the name of the manufacturer, importer, or maker, and such other identification as the Secretary may by regulations prescribe.

(b) Firearms without serial number.--Any person who possesses a firearm, other than a destructive device, which does not bear the serial number and other information required by subsection (a) of this section shall identify the firearm with a serial number assigned by the Secretary and any other information the Secretary may by regulations prescribe.

(c) Identification of destructive device.--Any firearm classified as a destructive device shall be identified in such manner as the Secretary may by regulations prescribe.

But:

26 U.S.C. § 5845 - U.S. Code - Unannotated Title 26. Internal Revenue Code § 5845. Definitions

For the purpose of this chapter--

(a) Firearm.--The term “firearm” means (1) a shotgun having a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length; (2) a weapon made from a shotgun if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 18 inches in length; (3) a rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length; (4) a weapon made from a rifle if such weapon as modified has an overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length; (5) any other weapon, as defined in subsection (e); (6) a machinegun; (7) any silencer (as defined in section 921 of title 18, United States Code); and (8) a destructive device. The term “firearm” shall not include an antique firearm or any device (other than a machinegun or destructive device) which, although designed as a weapon, the Secretary finds by reason of the date of its manufacture, value, design, and other characteristics is primarily a collector's item and is not likely to be used as a weapon.

So, unless the firearm in question is an NFA weapon, the federal law that the Minnesota statute cites does not require a serial number.

This doesn't seem vague to me. The Minnesota statute, as written, applies only to short-barreled rifles and shotguns.

[bstrawse]

"This doesn't seem vague to me. The Minnesota statute, as written, applies only to short-barreled rifles and shotguns."

We agree with you - but the MN Court of Appeals and several district courts in MN have taken a different approach in their decisions.

[Bearcatrp]

What is the difference between a AR 80% lower with no serial number and a AR with the serial number scratched off when it comes to the law? To me, both are now the same. Most likely, the criminals get a AR and they scratch off the serial number to make it untraceable. The law is to vague.

[jdege]

What is the difference between a AR 80% lower with no serial number and a AR with the serial number scratched off when it comes to the law?

Plenty.

Licensed manufacturers are required to mark with serial numbers. Those making firearms for their own personal use are not.

Removing a serial number is a crime.

[Jackpine Savage]

I'll be honest, I haven't paid much attention to the MN Supremes lately. How woke/stupid are they? Can they make a rational decision?

When will the ruling come down?

[bstrawse]

I'll be honest, I haven't paid much attention to the MN Supremes lately. How woke/stupid are they? Can they make a rational decision?

When will the ruling come down?

18 years of DFL appointments, no GOP justices presently. They're horrible on 2A issues.

b

[xd ED]

I'll be honest, I haven't paid much attention to the MN Supremes lately. How woke/stupid are they? Can they make a rational decision?

When will the ruling come down?

I haven't followed the court, but the information on Wiki seems to imply a lot of inside baseball, with justices being dfl appointed, as opposed to any having been elected for the past 3+ decades.

Minnesota Supreme Court

The seven justices of the Minnesota Supreme Court are elected to renewable six-year terms.[2] When a midterm vacancy occurs, the governor of Minnesota appoints a replacement to a term that ends after the general election occurring more than one year after the appointment.[3] Most vacancies occur during a term. The most recent election to an open seat on the court was in 1992, when former Minnesota Vikings player Alan Page was elected.

[Jackpine Savage]

Yikes.

If I was younger I'd be moving. South Dakota looks nice from here.