Obama protester totes rifle

[hammAR]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090817/ap_on_re_us/us_obama_protesters_guns

Man carrying assault weapon attends Obama protest
By AMANDA LEE MYERS and TERRY TANG, Associated Press Writers Amanda Lee Myers And Terry Tang, Associated Press Writers

PHOENIX – About a dozen people carrying guns, including one with a military-style rifle, milled among protesters outside the convention center where President Barack Obama was giving a speech Monday — the latest incident in which protesters have openly displayed firearms near the president.

Gun-rights advocates say they're exercising their constitutional right to bear arms and protest, while those who argue for more gun control say it could be a disaster waiting to happen.

Phoenix police said the gun-toters at Monday's event, including the man carrying an AR-15 semi-automatic rifle slung over his shoulder, didn't need permits. No crimes were committed, and no one was arrested.

The man with the rifle declined to be identified but told The Arizona Republic that he was carrying the assault weapon because he could. "In Arizona, I still have some freedoms," he said.

Phoenix police Detective J. Oliver, who monitored the man at the downtown protest, said police also wanted to make sure no one decided to harm him.

"Just by his presence and people seeing the rifle and people knowing the president was in town, it sparked a lot of emotions," Oliver said. "We were keeping peace on both ends."

Last week, during Obama's health care town hall in Portsmouth, N.H., a man carrying a sign reading "It is time to water the tree of liberty" stood outside with a pistol strapped to his leg.

"It's a political statement," he told The Boston Globe. "If you don't use your rights, then you lose your rights."

Police asked the man to move away from school property, but he was not arrested.

Fred Solop, a Northern Arizona University political scientist, said the incidents in New Hampshire and Arizona could signal the beginning of a disturbing trend.

"When you start to bring guns to political rallies, it does layer on another level of concern and significance," Solop said. "It actually becomes quite scary for many people. It creates a chilling effect in the ability of our society to carry on honest communication."

He said he's never heard of someone bringing an assault weapon near a presidential event. "The larger the gun, the more menacing the situation," he said.

Phoenix was Obama's last stop on a four-day tour of western states, including Montana and Colorado.

Authorities in Montana said they received no reports of anyone carrying firearms during Obama's health care town hall near Bozeman on Friday. About 1,000 people both for and against Obama converged at a protest area near the Gallatin Field Airport hangar where the event took place. One person accused of disorderly conduct was detained and released, according to the Gallatin Airport Authority.

Heather Benjamin of Denver's Mesa County sheriff's department, the lead agency during Obama's visit there, said no one was arrested.

Arizona is an "open-carry" state, which means anyone legally allowed to have a firearm can carry it in public as long as it's visible. Only someone carrying a concealed weapon is required to have a permit.

Paul Helmke, president of the Washington, D.C.-based Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence, said people should not be allowed to bring guns to events where Obama is.

"To me, this is craziness," he said. "When you bring a loaded gun, particularly a loaded assault rifle, to any political event, but particularly to one where the president is appearing, you're just making the situation dangerous for everyone."

He said people who bring guns to presidential events are distracting the Secret Service and law enforcement from protecting the president. "The more guns we see at more events like this, there's more potential for something tragic happening," he said.

Secret Service spokesman Ed Donovan said armed demonstrators in open-carry states such as Arizona and New Hampshire have little impact on security plans for the president.

"In both cases, the subject was not entering our site or otherwise attempting to," Donovan said. "They were in a designated public viewing area. The main thing to know is that they would not have been allowed inside with a weapon."

Representatives of the National Rifle Association did not return calls for comment.

[mnglocker]

So when are we going to start carrying long guns around here on a regular basis?

[tweener]

I've toyed with the idea, to see what would happen....honestly, My balls aren't big enough, and I don't look forward to having police train their rifles on me, and getting roughed up and handcuffed....only to be released hours later.

[Joecool]

Are you allowed to have an uncased long arm in Minnesota?

[plblark]

Phoenix police said the gun-toters at Monday's event, including the man carrying an AR-15 semi-automatic rifle slung over his shoulder, didn't need permits. No crimes were committed, and no one was arrested.

The man with the rifle declined to be identified but told The Arizona Republic that he was carrying the assault weapon because he could. "In Arizona, I still have some freedoms," he said.

Phoenix police Detective J. Oliver, who monitored the man at the downtown protest, said police also wanted to make sure no one decided to harm him.

"Just by his presence and people seeing the rifle and people knowing the president was in town, it sparked a lot of emotions," Oliver said. "We were keeping peace on both ends."

[countrymama]

He said he's never heard of someone bringing an assault weapon near a presidential event. "The larger the gun, the more menacing the situation," he said.

What? I mean, really... an AR, typically a .223 (not always) that is clearly visibble, and would be cumbersome to set up in the open and take a shot at the President* or anyone else you wanted to, is more menacing than a .45 pistol, that you may, or maynot know someone has depending on if they choose to open or concealed carry...? wtf people...

Authorities in Montana said they received no reports of anyone carrying firearms during Obama's health care town hall near Bozeman on Friday.

Thats because its Montana... its sorta like Texas... everyone carries there, they weren't alarmed so they didn't report it...

UGH!

[justaguy]

So when are we going to start carrying long guns around here on a regular basis?

You don't already?

[drkarrow]

Seeing these folks carrying at Obama events and not getting their rights assaulted gives me a glimmer of hope in these dark times.

[tweener]

Are you allowed to have an uncased long arm in Minnesota?

Only with a PTC.....

There was a change in what I beleive was DNR law, when the "shall issue MPPA" was passed, and the law used to say that you could not carry a shotgun or rifle in public places etc.....

The law change added an exception for people with PTC.

Most law enforcement are probabbly unaware of this, and likely you will be arrested, and may need to hire an attorney to argue with the prosecutor.....

An example case has not been made as far as I know, and likely if one were to happen, that was high profile, the law could easily be changed to dissalow it.

Walking down the street, or into Target with an AR-15 over your back, will likely draw attention, possible screams, and involve people running in all sorts of directions, But according to most interpertations of the law....would be perfectly legal.

Equally noted, the interpertaion of the law is that it DOES NOT allow you to carry an un-cased long gun in your car.....only in public places.

[Pat]

Try doing this up north, while glassing an open field at dusk. You'll wind up in the pokey for sure, permit or not.

The DNR has its own understanding of the law...

[tweener]

precisely why we need a law stating criminal code trumps DNR law when there is conflict.

[ttousi]

Are you allowed to have an uncased long arm in Minnesota?

Only with a PTC.....

There was a change in what I beleive was DNR law, when the "shall issue MPPA" was passed, and the law used to say that you could not carry a shotgun or rifle in public places etc.....

The law change added an exception for people with PTC.

Most law enforcement are probabbly unaware of this, and likely you will be arrested, and may need to hire an attorney to argue with the prosecutor.....

An example case has not been made as far as I know, and likely if one were to happen, that was high profile, the law could easily be changed to dissalow it.

Walking down the street, or into Target with an AR-15 over your back, will likely draw attention, possible screams, and involve people running in all sorts of directions, But according to most interpertations of the law....would be perfectly legal.

Equally noted, the interpertaion of the law is that it DOES NOT allow you to carry an un-cased long gun in your car.....only in public places.

You might be surprised what you can find in our very own reference section

viewtopic.php?f=35&t=42

[ttousi]

Equally noted, the interpertaion of the law is that it DOES NOT allow you to carry an un-cased long gun in your car.....only in public places.

And from the DNR to FAS Instructors regarding the recent casing law change:

Important Message for Instructors and Students
A once thought to be standard law in Minnesota has changed. This year the Firearms Transportation in Motor Vehicles Statute was changed to allow for transportation of uncased / unloaded firearms and bows under some circumstances. This law change goes into effect July 1st 2009.

A summary of the new law is as follows: Firearm, bow, and crossbow transportation allowed uncased. MS97B.035.2; 97B.045.2; 97B.45.3; 97B.051; 97C.345.2; effective 7-1-2009]

A person may transport an unloaded, uncased shotgun or rifle in a motor vehicle while:

1. At a shooting range with permission;
2. Lawfully hunting on public or private land;
3. Travelling to or from a site the person intends to hunt that day or has hunted that day.



A person may not transport an uncased shotgun or rifle:

4. Within Anoka, Hennepin, or Ramsey counties;
5. Within an area where the discharge of a firearm has been prohibited by a governmental subdivision;
6. Within the boundaries of a home rule charter city or statutory city with a population of 2,500 or more;
7. On school grounds; or
8. As otherwise regulated under the game refuge, shining, or night vision equipment statutes.
9. A handgun/pistol cannot be transported uncased without a permit to carry.



Repeals the restriction on possessing crossbows outdoors, and repeals the requirement to have the crossbow cased, unstrung, or in the closed trunk of a motor vehicle. Crossbows transported in a motor vehicle cannot be armed with a bolt or arrow. Repeals the transportation requirement to have a bow unstrung, completely contained in a case, or in the closed trunk or rear-most portion of a motor vehicle. Bows transported in a motor vehicle cannot be armed with a bolt or arrow.

Persons with a disability permit to shoot from a motor vehicle do not need to transport the firearm cased, but the firearm cannot be loaded in the chamber until the vehicle is stationary (or if a hinged action firearm with the action open until the vehicle is stationary).

Excludes BB guns, scuba guns, stud gun or nail gun used in the construction industry, or children’s pop guns or toys from this requirement.

In many instances, while traveling to or from a hunting location, the new law still requires firearms to be unloaded and cased. So our message can remain the same, the best way to transport firearms is always unloaded and cased.

So what does this mean to you? This change will not be reflected in our current Student and Instructor Manuals. We still have a large supply of manuals and will not be making any corrections until our next printing. Firearms transportation in motor vehicles is addressed in Goal 2, Unit 2. Page 38. The first paragraph of page 39, KNOW YOUR STATE’S LAW and OBEY IT is no longer correct in some situations but still correct in other situations. It’s our responsibility to make students aware of the change. Please read and understand the change and how it applies. Brainstorm with your student the reason why this is still the best way to transport firearms and bows. You can use this same exercise on Range and Field Day.

* Projects a positive image of the hunter.
* Provides additional safety and protection of firearms
* You never need to second guess if a case is needed or not.
* If you are in a situation where uncased is allowed, what is the best way to ensure it’s unloaded.
* Where should uncased firearms be placed in different motor vehicles i.e. boats, ATVs, etc…

[larasteven]

Do you think its legal now or not??

[justaguy]

Do you think its legal now or not??

Who was your instructor?

Legal to do what? Have an uncased long gun in your car or carry one?