Who has filed without a trust

[usnret]

The way you guys are describing a trust it would see you think it is 1) complicated 2) expensive. It is not either.

Yeah the chances are slim to none of getting into a bind with an NFA item. But if you can prevent it for a little more of your time and no additional cost why not? You guys make it seem like you need to endless hours and countless dollars to get a trust. If you are going to wait 4-6 months(or whatever the wait is now) what is an other hour or two(not even) to create a trust. It's like home owners insurance, do you plan on your house burning down? No!! Do you have homeowners insurance - yes. Why? For that one in a million chance something may happen. Trusts are the same for NFA items. The odds of actually needing them are slim to none. But the day you need a trust you REALLY NEED it.

I have not been in prison to date and plan on keeping it that way as long as I can. You will do jail time for illegal possession of an NFA item. It may only be a night or two but you will be going to jail while they sort everything out. My example of your spouse being in illegal possession is pretty slim. I would think they would just remove the NFA item from the house. In which case you will have to fight to get it back and possibly hire an attorney if they give you trouble. I don't think they would jail a spouse.

I am not saying there are not benefits to a trust. In fact I am considering which is the best way for myself. What I am saying is that I asked for realistic benefits and got craziness back in return.

There are downsides to a trust as well I am sure. I would like to hear honest, true pros AND cons really. Not just your wife will go to jail. That is just crazy. Also, I suspect the "free" trusts are quite limited in what they can accomplish, probably to do what I would look to use a trust for it is going to be a grand. Not that I am saying I am not going to do that, in fact I may, I am just saying I am trying to decide if it makes more sense to do a trust or go personal. One of the first obstacles as I see it is that you do not own it, the trust does. Whomever else is in the trust also owns it. What if you do not trust anybody?

Then get a hold of a lawyer that specializes in trusts and ask them your questions, and not then people on the forum.

[Sigfan220]

I said the chances of a spouse getting in trouble are low. Hanging onto NFA items for a friend, they will not cut you slack. I really don't think I'm being paranoid. You can't be in possession of an NFA item that is not yours period. Call the ATF NFA branch Monday and ask what the would do if you were in possession of you buddies NFA item. or if you were the one who had to have somebody baby sit you can while you went to the hospital or whatever.

You aren't hearing any cons because there aren't any. Trusts are free and take little time to form.

[brad3579]

The way you guys are describing a trust it would see you think it is 1) complicated 2) expensive. It is not either.

Yeah the chances are slim to none of getting into a bind with an NFA item. But if you can prevent it for a little more of your time and no additional cost why not? You guys make it seem like you need to endless hours and countless dollars to get a trust. If you are going to wait 4-6 months(or whatever the wait is now) what is an other hour or two(not even) to create a trust. It's like home owners insurance, do you plan on your house burning down? No!! Do you have homeowners insurance - yes. Why? For that one in a million chance something may happen. Trusts are the same for NFA items. The odds of actually needing them are slim to none. But the day you need a trust you REALLY NEED it.

I have not been in prison to date and plan on keeping it that way as long as I can. You will do jail time for illegal possession of an NFA item. It may only be a night or two but you will be going to jail while they sort everything out. My example of your spouse being in illegal possession is pretty slim. I would think they would just remove the NFA item from the house. In which case you will have to fight to get it back and possibly hire an attorney if they give you trouble. I don't think they would jail a spouse.

Give Ben Rust a call, he has a few different options. I am going to go with his silver (cost for GOCRA members $400).
http://minnesotaguntrustlawyer.com/pricing/

[Holland&Holland]

I said the chances of a spouse getting in trouble are low. Hanging onto NFA items for a friend, they will not cut you slack. I really don't think I'm being paranoid. You can't be in possession of an NFA item that is not yours period. Call the ATF NFA branch Monday and ask what the would do if you were in possession of you buddies NFA item. or if you were the one who had to have somebody baby sit you can while you went to the hospital or whatever.

You aren't hearing any cons because there aren't any. Trusts are free and take little time to form.

When did I talk about a friend?

You are the one who stated my wife would be arrested for knowing the code to the safe. Post an actual case or STFU.

[Holland&Holland]

The way you guys are describing a trust it would see you think it is 1) complicated 2) expensive. It is not either.

Yeah the chances are slim to none of getting into a bind with an NFA item. But if you can prevent it for a little more of your time and no additional cost why not? You guys make it seem like you need to endless hours and countless dollars to get a trust. If you are going to wait 4-6 months(or whatever the wait is now) what is an other hour or two(not even) to create a trust. It's like home owners insurance, do you plan on your house burning down? No!! Do you have homeowners insurance - yes. Why? For that one in a million chance something may happen. Trusts are the same for NFA items. The odds of actually needing them are slim to none. But the day you need a trust you REALLY NEED it.

I have not been in prison to date and plan on keeping it that way as long as I can. You will do jail time for illegal possession of an NFA item. It may only be a night or two but you will be going to jail while they sort everything out. My example of your spouse being in illegal possession is pretty slim. I would think they would just remove the NFA item from the house. In which case you will have to fight to get it back and possibly hire an attorney if they give you trouble. I don't think they would jail a spouse.

Give Ben Rust a call, he has a few different options. I am going to go with his silver (cost for GOCRA members $400).
http://minnesotaguntrustlawyer.com/pricing/

I have tried to talk to Ben and have his card. He is a busy guy.

[Holland&Holland]

The way you guys are describing a trust it would see you think it is 1) complicated 2) expensive. It is not either.

Yeah the chances are slim to none of getting into a bind with an NFA item. But if you can prevent it for a little more of your time and no additional cost why not? You guys make it seem like you need to endless hours and countless dollars to get a trust. If you are going to wait 4-6 months(or whatever the wait is now) what is an other hour or two(not even) to create a trust. It's like home owners insurance, do you plan on your house burning down? No!! Do you have homeowners insurance - yes. Why? For that one in a million chance something may happen. Trusts are the same for NFA items. The odds of actually needing them are slim to none. But the day you need a trust you REALLY NEED it.

I have not been in prison to date and plan on keeping it that way as long as I can. You will do jail time for illegal possession of an NFA item. It may only be a night or two but you will be going to jail while they sort everything out. My example of your spouse being in illegal possession is pretty slim. I would think they would just remove the NFA item from the house. In which case you will have to fight to get it back and possibly hire an attorney if they give you trouble. I don't think they would jail a spouse.

I am not saying there are not benefits to a trust. In fact I am considering which is the best way for myself. What I am saying is that I asked for realistic benefits and got craziness back in return.

There are downsides to a trust as well I am sure. I would like to hear honest, true pros AND cons really. Not just your wife will go to jail. That is just crazy. Also, I suspect the "free" trusts are quite limited in what they can accomplish, probably to do what I would look to use a trust for it is going to be a grand. Not that I am saying I am not going to do that, in fact I may, I am just saying I am trying to decide if it makes more sense to do a trust or go personal. One of the first obstacles as I see it is that you do not own it, the trust does. Whomever else is in the trust also owns it. What if you do not trust anybody?

Then get a hold of a lawyer that specializes in trusts and ask them your questions, and not then people on the forum.

Um you do realize this is a forum for just this sort of discussion right? Or do you just want to make Pelosi jokes?

[Hmac]

I said the chances of a spouse getting in trouble are low. Hanging onto NFA items for a friend, they will not cut you slack. I really don't think I'm being paranoid. You can't be in possession of an NFA item that is not yours period. Call the ATF NFA branch Monday and ask what the would do if you were in possession of you buddies NFA item. or if you were the one who had to have somebody baby sit you can while you went to the hospital or whatever.

You aren't hearing any cons because there aren't any. Trusts are free and take little time to form.

Can you cite any instances where someone has been arrested for such a violation?

On this and other gun forums, I see a lot of paranoid predictions of such dire consequences, but I have never seen a post by someone who actually got dinged by the ATF. I think that this concept is one of the most hysterically over-hyped fears in the firearms world.

There are no cons to getting a trust other than the expense and the hassle. On the other hand, if the reason for doing so is to keep your wife out of jail for an SBR in the closet, that's just nonsense.

[MJY65]

Can you cite any instances where someone has been arrested for such a violation?

I'd be interested in seeing that, too. Oh, I suppose there might be a case somewhere that an add on charge was thrown on top when they found the can next to the 20 pounds of meth in the safe, but that's a bit different.

On the Rx drug issue: You see it all the time on TV shows. Guy has a baggie full of mixed pills with no Rx. Cop tells him that he needs to transport them in the original bottle. (Probably is the letter of the law). Who the hell does that? I take a couple of meds (not narcotic) and carry my one day dose with me in a small pill pack. I'm sure as heck not walking around with the 3 month supply in a bottle and neither is anyone else. The point being: The cop knows good and well that no Rx exists in that case. There is no bottle at home and there is no pharmacy to call and confirm.

So, let's hear them: Otherwise law abiding wife or friend charged with a crime for knowing a safe combination or securing an NFA item while owner was being transported to the hospital. Law abiding individual arrested for picking up spouse's Rx from Walgreens

[Ghost]

Trusts may add cost

Trusts allow more flexibility

If you have no trustees they are minimal extra effort

Trusts have benefits upon your death

NFA should be terminated and suppressors should be sold at Home Depot.

Anything I missed?

[hammAR]

Other than abolish the BATF - nothing that I can see.............

[BigDog58]

Can you cite any instances where someone has been arrested for such a violation?

I'd be interested in seeing that, too. Oh, I suppose there might be a case somewhere that an add on charge was thrown on top when they found the can next to the 20 pounds of meth in the safe, but that's a bit different.

On the Rx drug issue: You see it all the time on TV shows. Guy has a baggie full of mixed pills with no Rx. Cop tells him that he needs to transport them in the original bottle. (Probably is the letter of the law). Who the hell does that? I take a couple of meds (not narcotic) and carry my one day dose with me in a small pill pack. I'm sure as heck not walking around with the 3 month supply in a bottle and neither is anyone else. The point being: The cop knows good and well that no Rx exists in that case. There is no bottle at home and there is no pharmacy to call and confirm.

So, let's hear them: Otherwise law abiding wife or friend charged with a crime for knowing a safe combination or securing an NFA item while owner was being transported to the hospital. Law abiding individual arrested for picking up spouse's Rx from Walgreens

I had to take heavy narcotic pain killers for 14+ years. For at least 6 of those years, I was unable to walk more than a few feet, much less drive. My wife had to pickup my prescriptions monthly from Walgreens (including narcotics) and not once, was either of us worried about her being stopped by the Po-Po and ending up in jail.

I unfortunately sold my NFA Auto's before moving to MN in 2002. At the time I sold them, I was unaware that MN didn't allow full auto weapons (GA was much friendlier to them). I only discovered this after moving here. If I ever acquire another NFA qualified item, I believe I'll go the Trust route. Especially, since my wife came here from a Commie Country. They might think she's an "infiltrator" even though she's a citizen now..

[BigDog58]

Trusts may add cost

Trusts allow more flexibility

If you have no trustees they are minimal extra effort

Trusts have benefits upon your death

NFA should be terminated and suppressors should be sold at Home Depot.

Anything I missed?

Best Plan I've heard so far... Well, this and add hammAR's idea of "abolish the BATF"

[LumberZach]

With the prospect of the hearing protection act, I'm waiting to see what happens before filing. I'll probably keep waiting until I'm an old man and just go for it.

The trust seemed like a good option when you needed sheriff signature. Aside from the transfer at death I don't really see any benefits in doing a trust anymore. I'd really hate to get a free legal trust from a company I'll never speak to that doesn't know all of the nuances of Minnesota law. If anything I would go with a Ben Rust trust. That's $100 though on the cheap end, and I'm worried it will be more complicated than just transferring to myself. I have no wife, or kids though so that certainly limits my necessity.


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[Hmac]

The trust seemed like a good option when you needed sheriff signature. Aside from the transfer at death I don't really see any benefits in doing a trust anymore. I'd really hate to get a free legal trust from a company I'll never speak to that doesn't know all of the nuances of Minnesota law. If anything I would go with a Ben Rust trust. That's $100 though on the cheap end, and I'm worried it will be more complicated than just transferring to myself. I have no wife, or kids though so that certainly limits my necessity.

And putting existing NFA items that you own into your new trust will cost you another $200 and a Form 4 each.

[Ghost]

It'd be interesting to hear Ben's opinion on trusts