New .223 Rifle

[yuppiejr]

Bummer on the CZ, looks like the link above was an old clearance ad/price.

Given the options considered I'd give the nod to the Savage FV mentioned previously for $419 @ Cabelas as the best bang for your buck. I think it's a great pairing with the Vortex Diamondback HP/SF scope you mentioned (basically these are the old Vortex Viper non-suffix scopes)... the included polymer stock is pillar bedded and the action includes an oversized bolt handle which are notable upgrades from the standard Savage offerings. I don't love the stiff lift in the Savage bolt's but this is somewhat improved with the larger bolt handle, and can be further improved with a bit of engagement surface polishing (look about 1/3 of the way down this page) ; http://www.steyrscout.org/savscout.htm

I'd also add a Howa 1500, Weatherby Vanguard 2 and the Winchester model 70 to your list of rifles to look at.

[UnaStamus]

Redfield is owned by Leupold, and the Revolution line of scopes are the same as the Leupold VX-1. The Revenge series are the same as the Leupold Rifleman. If you picked up the Remington with the Redfield, you would be getting a pretty decent scope. While certainly not the configuration you're looking for, it's suffice and make a good scope for another rifle. If you sold it, you could definitely recoup over $100.

That said, be wary of spending money on scopes solely for the options. When you don't have concurrent scope quality, the options don't pan out to be a benefit. Nikon and Vortex make good optics, so you're fine there. Just be careful of the fact that you are always going to make compromises when shopping in the "low end". Each scope company has different attributes that characterize their scopes. Nikon is known for good light transmission and color fidelity. Vortex is known for that as well. Leupold is known for resolution, clarity of picture (minimal distortion) and light transmission. Stuff like that. Before you commit to one scope, look around and test some scopes to see which one fits your needs optically. Make sure that it's a company that is reputable and will back their scopes.

As far as the rifle, pay attention to twist rate. Most .223 bolt action rifles come in 1:12 twist, which generally will only stabilize 55gr and lighter bullets. If you want to shoot heavier/longer bullets, look into a 1:9/8/7 twist option.

[JJ]

the Revolution line of scopes are the same as the Leupold VX-1. The Revenge series are the same as the Leupold Rifleman

This is false. The Leupold branded optics are machined and assembled in the US. The Redfield optics are manufactuered entirely overseas.

[shooter115]

My vote here is for the Savage 10/12 series rifles. They are generally among the more accurate "out of the box" rifles. Comes factory with an acceptable trigger, is easily upgraded/modified and there is a ton of aftermarket support for them. This rifle started life as a .223 FVS, is now a 6BR and about the only factory parts left are the receiver, bolt body and barrel nut.

[jspace]

I have a CZ 527 Varmint. I love the set trigger on it.
They had CZs at Little Crow last time I was there, but I don't recall if there was a Varmint SKU. Might be worth a trip that way to check it out. Otherwise the Savage would be a great choice IMO.

[MaryB]

My Savage Axis was sub MOA out of the box with my handloads and the cheap Bushnell scope it came with. Only dislike is the bolt clearance to the scope body is tight, I smack my knuckle all the time... Might not be an issue for you if you can mount the scope further forward. I have neck issues and can't get a tight cheek weld

[UnaStamus]

the Revolution line of scopes are the same as the Leupold VX-1. The Revenge series are the same as the Leupold Rifleman

This is false. The Leupold branded optics are machined and assembled in the US. The Redfield optics are manufactuered entirely overseas.

Same glass, same coatings, same assembly standards and requirements. Do a side-by-side comparison with the Redfields and their Leupold counterparts and you can't tell the difference because optically, there is none. Mechanically there is none either.

As a point of order, keep in mind that the Leupold Rifleman series is manufactured in China. Leupold also gets many components for their scopes from China, which is why their scopes are no longer branded "Made in USA" (due to the unrelated Leatherman lawsuit).

To my knowledge, there are only two scopes that are 100% made in USA, and neither of them are made by Leupold.

[JJ]

the Revolution line of scopes are the same as the Leupold VX-1. The Revenge series are the same as the Leupold Rifleman

This is false. The Leupold branded optics are machined and assembled in the US. The Redfield optics are manufactuered entirely overseas.

Same glass, same coatings, same assembly standards and requirements. Do a side-by-side comparison with the Redfields and their Leupold counterparts and you can't tell the difference because optically, there is none. Mechanically there is none either.

As a point of order, keep in mind that the Leupold Rifleman series is manufactured in China. Leupold also gets many components for their scopes from China, which is why their scopes are no longer branded "Made in USA" (due to the unrelated Leatherman lawsuit).

To my knowledge, there are only two scopes that are 100% made in USA, and neither of them are made by Leupold.

Notice that nowhere did i say the glass was made in the USA. Machined parts yes. I would also point to the fact that the assembly operations in China and the US are a world apart (literally and fuguratively).

No optic maker to my knowledge is using US manufactured glass, as the US does not produce glass that is of a suitable grade for the task intended. Lots of companies are buying glass from overseas, assembling in the US, and labeling as "Made in USA" though.

[hammAR]

They are generally among the more accurate "out of the box" rifles. Comes factory with an acceptable trigger..................

This gives me about the same level of confidence as a fart -
the day after drinking Ex-Lax chocolate martinis, eating hard boiled eggs, and stopping on the way home for a half dozen sliders.............

[yuppiejr]

the Revolution line of scopes are the same as the Leupold VX-1. The Revenge series are the same as the Leupold Rifleman

This is false. The Leupold branded optics are machined and assembled in the US. The Redfield optics are manufactuered entirely overseas.

The Redfield Revenge is manufactured in the Philippines (same as many of the Vortex Diamondback & Viper, Nikon Monarch, Weaver 40/44 series, etc..) while the Redfield Revolution scopes are made in the Oregon, USA facility. I don't know that there's any relationship between the Rifleman and the Revenge scopes though, they are both contract manufactured overseas (Philippines and China respectively) for their parent brands in different countries.

Also... the Ruger American package rifles include the Redfield Revolution 3-9x40mm plex reticle scope, for a budget package rifle it's a pretty good setup at that $525-550 mark.

[yuppiejr]

As far as the rifle, pay attention to twist rate. Most .223 bolt action rifles come in 1:12 twist, which generally will only stabilize 55gr and lighter bullets. If you want to shoot heavier/longer bullets, look into a 1:9/8/7 twist option.

Among the rifles discussed in this thread, the Savage FV 12 is a 1:9 twist, the Ruger American a 1:8, the Remington 700 SPS Varmint is a 1:12 though the SPS Tactical variant is a 1:9, the CZ 527 Varmint model is a 1:9.

The longer the barrel and faster the bullet the less critical twist rate is to stabilizing bullets, though it becomes a factor at longer ranges... out to 300 I don't see it being a major issue, though as always other factors like the specific projectile, powder and barrel characteristics will play a role.

On the prior topic of the scope bundled with the Remington rifle, it's a Redfield Battlezone made in the Phillipines like the Revenge model, it's worth about half to 60% of what the Revolution sells for in the secondary market.

[shooter115]

They are generally among the more accurate "out of the box" rifles. Comes factory with an acceptable trigger..................

This gives me about the same level of confidence as a fart -
the day after drinking Ex-Lax chocolate martinis, eating hard boiled eggs, and stopping on the way home for a half dozen sliders.............

I only have 3 bolt action centerfire rifles as of today. One has a Remington action, one has a Sako action and one has a Savage action. All three have aftermarket barrels and triggers. Of those 3, the best shooting rifle out of the box was the Savage, which also had the best trigger. It just wasn't good enough for what I wanted.

[LePetomane]

Hyperlight, whatever you decide on, don't skimp on optics. There is the thought that one should spend as much on the scope as on the rifle. In some cases that is a little much. But if you plan on taking the gun on the trip of a lifetime then it is $$$ well spent. My personal favorites for optics are Nikon for my target rifle and Zeiss for my 30-06.

[hammAR]

They are generally among the more accurate "out of the box" rifles. Comes factory with an acceptable trigger..................

This gives me about the same level of confidence as a fart -
the day after drinking Ex-Lax chocolate martinis, eating hard boiled eggs, and stopping on the way home for a half dozen sliders.............

I only have 3 bolt action centerfire rifles as of today. One has a Remington action, one has a Sako action and one has a Savage action. All three have aftermarket barrels and triggers. Of those 3, the best shooting rifle out of the box was the Savage, which also had the best trigger. It just wasn't good enough for what I wanted.

So admittedly, “out of the box” for a mediocre platform doesn't really mean crap when one has to spend hundreds or even thousands of dollars to get it to shoot accurately..........

I do have a passing understanding of firearm platforms and their mechanisms. I normally shoot either my Chandler (308) or one of the Hospitallers (308 & 6.5-284), but the OP asked for entry level, out of the box as a first rifle for target shooting and varmint hunting.

I would point him to a CZ 550 Varmint 7.62 (308 Win) platform with a 25.6" barrel - $800-900 range. The CZ is a Mauser action with a single set-adjustable trigger. It's probably the best action out of those that have been listed. The 550 Varmint platform comes from the factory with a nice HS precision stock with aluminum bedding blocks and is fully floated from the factory. You can tell the difference in quality by picking it up, working the action or just plain looking at it.

I would put the out-the-box accuracy of it on par with rifles that are twice as expensive or take hundreds or even thousands of dollars to get it to shoot accurately, if you don't plan to tinker with it at all, the CZ may limit you, but will serve you well.

Why do I state that – because I bought one and the only changes from “out of the box” modifications were to add a Ken Ferrel 20 moa rail, some badger rings, and an old US Optics 5-25x scope to it. Shooting hand loaded 168gr. Sierra Match Kings, I sighted it in and quickly moved to shoot two twenty round strings at 600 yards for score. Using the SR-3 target, which had I believe a 3″ X-ring and a 7″ 10-ring and just hoped that my shots would cluster somewhere near the center of that space. Well round 1 was 196 – 9x and round 2 was 198 – 14x............I would generally call that sub-moa and that is “out of the box"!

So in conclusion, CZ makes a hell of a rifle that one could easily with confidence use to shoot F-Class Open or F-Class/Target Rifle (F/TR) category, let alone 100 yard targets and coyotes - but then again I am not addressing the .223 question/requirement of the OP - I just have extreme confidence with any CZ platform, therefore would recommend a CZ-527 Varmint (.223)- $700-800 Range.

For a beginner and first rifle, it all depends on how much you want to spend, how much you want to tinker, with the knowledge that there is a platform that shoots better than most of the shooters on this board can.

[Jackpine Savage]

This is sounding like a Ford Chevy discussion but the mediocre stock Savages have been doing pretty well in competition.

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2009/08/savage-f-tr-team-world-beaters-on-a-budget/

I went the Savage route awhile back after reading a post on here by Ragged on how he put together a rifle. If the OP likes to tinker the one nice thing about Savage is the ability to put a new barrel on yourself. I used a Savage target action and a Shilen barrel purchased from Northland Shooters supply.

I just noticed Northland Shooter supply has a deal on Remington 783's. It looks like the sincerest form of flattery, the 783 has a floating bolt head, barrel nut, and trigger that looks just like Savage.