450 Bushmaster

Discussion of rifles, shotguns, and muzzleloaders

Re: 450 Bushmaster

Postby BigDog58 on Wed Dec 04, 2019 3:22 am

crbutler wrote:As far as shooting large bore rifles...

Take this for what it is worth. My experiences.

First, the higher end recoil wise.

I find the recoil of a .416 Rigby hunting rifle from the bench tolerable, but not fun. As in I can get by 10-20 or so rounds for checking ammo and checking zero in one range session.

I wouldn't do that with a fused neck. I shot it once from prone when a hunt required it. That was decidedly unpleasant. That I wouldn't do if I had back or neck problems... no game animal is worth that risk.

The same rifle off shooting sticks or standing supported is not unpleasant at all. I wouldn't be concerned about someone who has been cleared by their surgeon to shoot it in that manner. By comparison, my bad weather DG gun is a .416 Remington. Its a full pound lighter. With the muzzle brake off it is much less fun to shoot than the Rigby. With the brake (which is small) its about the same as the Rigby.

My .470 NE double rifle is decidedly unpleasant from the bench. Given that it doesn't regulate from the bench, I always shoot it from standing (with sticks if checking things). Standing, while it moves you around (most newer guys who try it take a step back on firing) I don't think shooting that from standing is a problem for a fused back.

The .375 H&H rifle is by comparison a pussycat. I have no issue with shooting a box or two of ammo from the bench with it. Standing is a nonissue at all. This is in a 9# sporter.

I've shot a single shot AR 50 with a big brake this was from a bench. No where near as bad as any of the above, excepting the .375. This was about a 20# rifle.

My Barrett 82 is a 36# piece with a big brake as well. I have only shot this from prone. It is not at all unpleasant and I have had friend's 12 year old daughters shoot it with no complaint. This has a lot of muzzle blast, but felt recoil is like someone pushing you back on the shoulder with a pillow.

A .378 Weatherby is not a fun thing to shoot at all. The recoil is rather hard, and VERY sharp. See the above, and I shot exactly 2 rounds through one, and will be happy to never shoot one again. A better stock might help some, but I don't see a need.

Now to more germane...

A .300 Ultra mag sporter (about 7-8#) is somewhat sharp and unpleasant from the bench. Its still sharp from standing, but not horrible.

I have a .300 Win Mag M70- this has a brake and a suppressor. With the brake, from the bench, its like a .30-06 (its not a big brake, more a hunting style one). With the suppressor, its like a .22-250.

.45-70 is less than the .300, but more a push. With the metal butt plates I have on mine (Sharps reproduction, Win 1886) they do cause some shoulder discomfort with 500 grain loads- but with 400 grain black powder, they are less unpleasant than a .30-06.

.44 mag carbine (Ruger or M92) is a jump, but not painful at all. about like a .410 shotgun.

9mm AR style rifle- more than a .22 RF but insignificant.

So, my rather long winded way of stating all this is-

I would not worry about shooting a bigger gun from field positions despite your surgery.

I would not shoot over a .300 without a good brake for anything prolonged from a bench with your surgery. This includes the various big bore AR's. They won't slap you, but they DO move you around. If you are locked into a position where you can't move, they will cause some muscle pain after shooting. My suspicion is that you could have gotten a suppressor or a big target style brake like they put on the .50 rifles, added weight to it and shot it from a bipod with your .338 Lapua and you wouldn't have had much trouble. The biggest issue is using a bench. You are taking the full recoil force with your spine, and it is moving through it. I am sure the .50 target guys will confirm- with a heavy brake and a heavy rifle, the .50 target guns are not that bad at recoil, and I know more than a few physically handicapped guys who shoot .50 BMG target guns.

You will probably not like any of the above AR style big bores if your idea of fun is sitting at a bench and whacking steel at longer ranges for long periods of time. From a field position, it won't bother you nearly as much. For 10 or so shots, it probably won't be as big a problem, but still it might lead to some discomfort the day after, especially if you don't put some kind of brake (not flash suppressor) on it. Recoil wise, to me the bushmaster and the SOCOM are of a oneness. I haven't shot a Beowulf so that I can't say for sure, but ballistics-wise its in the same group as far as recoil.


I'm one of those "physically handicap guys" that shoots my 38 lb State Arms 50 BMG, and even with my back injuries, it isn't a terrible recoil. We did put an AR-50 Muzzle Brake on it (the State Arms brake kicked like a mule), and I've shot as many as 135 rounds in three days, at a match. I shoot strictly from the bench, because I'm unable to properly mount the gun to my shoulder in the prone position (No DAMN Jokes from OldmanFCSA :shock: ) nor can I easily get up from laying on the ground. I load a quite heavy load behind my 800 gr Brass Boreriders (my gun happens to like this combination), and while I get some blowback from the brake, it's not uncomfortable to me.

Lastly, crbutler, your post was very encompassing and I have to agree with some of your observations as to the recoil from some of the guns you mentioned. Several years ago, I loaded some 338 Win Mag for a friend, and we went to OGC to test my 50 and he wanted to test the rounds I had loaded him. Well, after we had both shot a few rounds I let him shoot my 50 and he handed me his 338 WM to try. I took his rifle and thought it felt quite light (later found out is was about 6.5 lbs), but thought WTH, let's see how those rounds I loaded shoot? I shot exactly ONE Round from his gun. It slapped my shoulder like a pro baseball player swinging a bat :cry: . I have not shot his gun since, nor do I EVER intend to shoot it again.

BearcatRP: I wish you could shoot the heavier calibers with us. Hopefully, you'll find one that meets your abilities. I know how bad back issues can be.

PS: I am not recoil sensitive as far as rifles go.
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Re: 450 Bushmaster

Postby Bearcatrp on Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:52 am

When I had the savage 338LM, would get shoulder fatigue after 8-10 shots, back was wacked out for about a week. The RPR 338LM that I sold to oldman, was heavier and absorbed allot of the recoil so could shoot 50 rounds without shoulder fatigue but still wacked my back out for a bit. Figured a big bore AR would be less of that initial jolt due to the buffer and spring but have not shot one so don't know how it would go. It would be a range to. I think its the dam hardware in my back causing the issues though. Have to wait until 2 years after the surgery to request it be removed. Thats next may. For now my biggest bore is 308. Have considered the 300 PRC bolt rifle but after looking at reloading stuff to see whats out there, only Hornady is producing brass for it. Am in nor hurry so just checking on different calibers for now. Just miss a big boomer to shoot.
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RPR 338 Lapua Magnum

Postby OldmanFCSA on Wed Dec 04, 2019 4:17 pm

Thank you for the rifle - a cartridge I had no intention to shoot but which I now love.

I have a Thomson-Center Contender pistol chambered in 444Marlin which I call Big-Bore while shooting 300-350 cast lead projectiles. You can try it if you want something different.

A few members have tried it to only pass it back to me after 1 shot.

Anyways Thank You for the RPR 338LM. I've gotten a few supplies like 400 BBR-15-16 Lapua cases, 500 H285ELDM's, 300 Berger 300OTM's, and some rifle accessories like bi-pod, green laser sighter, carry slings off hardpoints, ........ H1000 and Retumbo powder in 1 pound cans.(my source is holding 8-pounders of each for me).....

Too cold for me to shoot now.
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Re: 450 Bushmaster

Postby Bearcatrp on Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:44 pm

That RPR in 338LM is one sweet rifle. I miss it. Am sure you can use it to its full potential. Its a beast. You showed me that monster pistol. No thanks. Will pass on shooting it. Plan on trying the RPR at the Whittington range?
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RPR 338 Lapua Magnum

Postby OldmanFCSA on Wed Dec 04, 2019 8:44 pm

Not enough horsepower for the King Of 2-Mile competition.

I will take to Alliance for un-official 1000 yard sight-in on 4" clay pigeons. There is a competition in Kansas of 2200 yards = MAYBE.

338 Lapua Magnum is good for 1.5 miles (2640 yards) stretched to 1.75 miles (3080 yards) but not for 2 miles (3520 yards).
I need more testing of which projectile is most stable when going sub-sonic.

IF I get busy I may even try coated projectile and barrel technology using WS2 (Tungsten DiSulfide) but would need to get a 34-36" barrel for proper propellant burn within barrel. I would need to get up near 3400 FPS at 15 feet from muzzle with a 300 grain Berger OTM projectile to be competitive against 375/408/416/460 caliber cartridges currently in use.

PLUS I need more practice.
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Re: 450 Bushmaster

Postby BigDog58 on Thu Dec 05, 2019 12:57 am

Bearcatrp wrote:That RPR in 338LM is one sweet rifle. I miss it. Am sure you can use it to its full potential. Its a beast. You showed me that monster pistol. No thanks. Will pass on shooting it. Plan on trying the RPR at the Whittington range?


Oldman let me shoot that RPR and you are absolutely right. It's a "sweet rifle". I didn't even notice any recoil, and it is extremely accurate, at least at the 200 yards we were shooting.

Oldman has offered to let me shoot that TC pistol in 444 Marlin several times. I won't even try it, because I broke my wrist playing high school football, and still have issues with that wrist 34 years later. I'm not only worried about dropping his gun upon firing, but also worried that it may damage my wrist again. The strongest pistol I've shot, is a Ruger Super Redhawk in .44 Mag that I used to hunt with. Even after just firing a few shots for practice and sighting in, my wrist would hurt for days. I did manage to take a nice 12 pt buck with it, and amazingly, I felt no pain after that shot :shock: Unfortunately, that pistol was stolen from me, right after my house burned in 2009. I wished I still had it.
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Re: 450 Bushmaster

Postby Bearcatrp on Thu Dec 05, 2019 6:19 am

The bolt is so smooth on that RPR. Ruger did its homework building that rifle. Will make a dam good 1 mile competition rifle with a few mods. Definitely those bigger calibers would walk all over the 338LM. I see the 416 is doing very well at the 2 mile competition.
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Re: 450 Bushmaster

Postby Bearcatrp on Tue Dec 10, 2019 6:06 pm

Since the 300 Ham'R is out of the question, back to this question. Looking at all 3, 450 bushmaster, 458 socom and 50 Beo, all are close. Its components that I want access too. Bullets can be ok on all but brass seems to be a little issue. After the BS I went through my grendel, I don't want another feeding issue. From what i have read so far, the 450 bushmaster seems most supported.
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Re: 450 Bushmaster

Postby Holland&Holland on Tue Dec 10, 2019 6:38 pm

I think from a component perspective all 3 are fairly equal. A bit more bullet selection in the .45s of course.

.450 busy is more supported in loaded ammo of course so if you buy factory and then reload one could say it has more options.
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