I got a real problem here... Thoughts needed.

[Josh189]

Alright guys. I need a rifle. I've got it narrowed down to three. Armalite AR10 A4 16", Rem 700 SPS Tactical 20" Bull, or an Rock River LAR-15 16" Chrome moly. I'll primarily be using it for Deer Hunting but will also be shooting it at the range as well. I was wondering if anybody else has been through this before and could give me some wisdom. The AR10 is the mid ground, and I'd like all the accessories of the AR platform, and I also like the accuracy. But then again the 700 kills it in accuracy. With the .223 the weight is lower than the AR10, and the 700 is almost nothing in comparison. Then there's the difference in pricing. Guys I need help, November's coming quick and I want to be proficient before I go out this year so I'd like some time to get familiar with whatever system I end up with. As always your advice is always appreciated. Thanks in advance.

J.

[Norsesmithy]

If you are considering a AR-15 style .308 (and they are all scaled up AR-15s, NOT AR-10 clones, even the late model Armalite AR-10s), do yourself a favor and get one compatible with the DPMS/KAC pattern mags. They have far and a away more support, across the breadth of various aftermarket parts makers.

If you aren't thinking about KAC money, but don't want a DPMS, get an LMT.

And if you want to chase bolt gun accuracy, get a match trigger, a custom barrel maker's barrel, have someone blueprint and true the action, and start working up loads. There are AR-15 pattern .308s out there that are 1/8 MOA rifles.

[farmerj]

small difference, but the AR-10 came BEFORE the AR-15.

Based on the AR-10, Army officials asked Armalite to develop a smaller version of the AR-10 in 1956 as part of evaluations of what were then referred to as Small Caliber High Velocity (SCHV) rifles. The ensuing rifle was called the AR-15.

[crbutler]

All of these choices are a lot heavier weight wise than I would choose for a hunting rifle. .308 is great for deer, .223 much less so. The oddball AR cartridges (.300 blackout, 30 AR,6.8 SPC, 6.5 Grendel) are not a real good option right now as the dust hasn't settled on what will be the de facto standard.

The .308 AR's can be very accurate. They are also heavy, and more expensive to feed than the smaller (.223) guns, and you will need to find 5 round mags to hunt with in most jurisdictions. The comment on Knight/ DPMS pattern mags is right on as well.

The 700 Remington is a good starter bolt gun. I know the heavier barrel models do tend to shoot well. It will be less of an issue to feed it and come up with good reloads for a bolt gun. Don't discount the Savage either, as they do tend to shoot very well out of the box, and seem to be cheaper than remington.

All are great for target shooting, but the heavier barrels tend to have more stability with repeated shots.

If you are after a hunting gun primarily and a paper puncher secondarily get a light weight barrel bolt gun and just admit you need to wait longer between shots to keep the heat issue at bay. If you want a AR, varmint rig or a paper gun principally, a heavy barreled 20-26" gun is good.

[Dave Pendleton]

This is purely anectdotal, but I've encountered AR-10's several times working the range at OGC. All of them ran like crap. There are a thousand possible reasons for this, I know, but that's what I saw.

[Norsesmithy]

small difference, but the AR-10 came BEFORE the AR-15.

Based on the AR-10, Army officials asked Armalite to develop a smaller version of the AR-10 in 1956 as part of evaluations of what were then referred to as Small Caliber High Velocity (SCHV) rifles. The ensuing rifle was called the AR-15.

Correct, and of the distinctions in operating method and construction between AR-10, and AR-15, besides the caliber, the passel of commercially available .308 ARs are similar to the AR-15, not the AR-10.

[farmerj]

Personally, i'd find a used la stevens 200 and build it up how I wanted from there. Either in 280 rem or a sa in 6.5 swede

[1911fan]

Where do you hunt and what is your primary method of hunting?

Is this play gun first, deer rifle second, or other way around.

If it's a deer gun primary I would look at what are possible ranges you will shoot on your land.

Less than one fifty, look for a marlin or Winchester lever. Over one fifty, start looking for a .243 to .308 lightweight. Deer don't bite, and they die easy. And you don't need thirty round mags for deer.

[yuppiejr]

Probably two separate use cases here for the same rifle, I'd buy for the task at hand and purchase a separate play gun as funds permit. You don't need a $2,500 tack driving target rifle to hunt deer - you need a quality, utility rifle that you can shoot consistently and not worry about a variety of conditions or the inevitable scratches and bangs that go along with a hunting trip. unless you're shooting seriously long range (and most north woods shooters I know take their deer inside of 50-100 yards) a modest bolt action rifle in .308 like the Stevens 200 or Marlin XS7 (or any number of quality used rifles) along with a 2-7x Leupold scope ($200 at Fleet Farm, others) would last most hunters a lifetime for a total investment of $600. Spend the rest on a separate AR in 5.56 for a "fun/defense" gun probably in a midlength gassed carbine configuration since you've got the hunting bases covered already. Spikes is a good place to start and you can skip the optics and stick with a flat top & rear BUIS / A2 front sight to keep it affordable out of the gate.

[yuppiejr]

<double tap... FNG... >

[LarryFlew]

The .308 AR's can be very accurate. They are also heavy, and more expensive to feed than the smaller (.223) guns, and you will need to find 5 round mags to hunt with in most jurisdictions. The comment on Knight/ DPMS pattern mags is right on as well.

care to share where that 5 round mag info is and in what state?

[old guy]

I really like my DPMS .308 with a 16" heavy barrel, with match ammo it shot just over 1''. It is BY FAR the lightest recoiling .308 I have ever fired, yeah it's heavy at 8 lbs empty but the balance is sweet. The adjustable stock rattles to much for hunting so I switched it for an A2, also put in a JP trigger. As has been said you don't need a 20 rd mag to hunt deer so I have a 4 rd. one. Now I need to get back on my feet so I can hunt with it.

John

[Hammer99...]

I have a DPMS in 308 and a Remington 700 in 308. I have a few ARs in 223 but no varmint configurations. They will all do the job. If money is no object. I think from the bench the AR in 308 is the most fun. It’s ability to soak up 308 recoil is pretty impressive. Personally I almost never shoot the 700 since I got the DPMS so it’s a no brainer for me.

[45Badger]

The .308 AR's can be very accurate. They are also heavy, and more expensive to feed than the smaller (.223) guns, and you will need to find 5 round mags to hunt with in most jurisdictions. The comment on Knight/ DPMS pattern mags is right on as well.

care to share where that 5 round mag info is and in what state?

In just about every place I have lived and hunted before I moved here (many places ). Never really understood why states put a mag restriction on deer guns. After listening to two distinct yahoos (bozos,maroons, asswipes?) dump more than 10 rounds on opening day up north, I understand.

To the OPs point, a .308 bolt gun is a a great deer gun. .223 is not a great deer round and most yahoos in the woods are not selective and accurate enough in their shooting to cleanly and ethically take a deer with that round. The SPS tactical is a great gun for the price. Look for one on sale or lightly used on A15.com or snipershide.com.

[Josh189]

Yeah I knew the .223 would be terrible for hunting. I just thought I'd double check cause my crazy buddy wanted to hunt with it last year, and I ridiculed him up and down. Then his Dad joined in saying that with the right load you can drop a deer. Anyways, I know I want a .308. But I want to have some fun too. I think I'm gonna go with the AR. Now! Does anyone know a decent place that'll leave with some money for optics? Also how does the Armalite stack up? Should I go looking for something else? Let me know what you guys think.

Signed,

The FNG