New to guns - Advice on AR's

[Sledaddict82]

I'm pretty new to firearms, I have a few but don't know TOO much about them. I'm thinking about getting an AR sometime between now and Spring.
I was looking for some advice on them, I know theres a billion options on what parts/accessories to get and brands and too much to even talk about.
I want one for simple shooting, long range target shots 200yds+, and maybe hunting in the future (I am not a hunter but am considering it)

What is the best brand?
What's a good price on a complete gun (minus accessories)
Does anyone shoot 7.62x39 AR's?
.223/5.56mm/7.62x39?? What's the best?
I would be willing to spend $1000 tops for a good gun
What's with everyone talking about different lowers/uppers/barrels etc.??

Basically I'm a newby and I want an AR but have no idea where to even start because there's so many options

Thanks in advance

Nick

[shooter115]

Welcome Nick.....That's quite the bag of questions. Personally I'm a huge fan of the AR platform and own......let's say a couple

What is the best brand? For the price range your looking at and what you want to do I'n going to say go with a DPMS. There are better out there, but you will pay for it. If you are somewhat mechanicly inclined you could build one from a kit with an assembled upper. Check out Palmetto State Armory

What's a good price on a complete gun (minus accessories).....You should be able to find yourself a decent mid level AR for around $8-900. Just don't forget about buying a GOOD scope and mount, but thats a whole nother thread for you.

Does anyone shoot 7.62x39 AR's? Good ammo burners, not much for target shooting from my experience.

.223/5.56mm/7.62x39?? What's the best? .223/5.56 is far more accurate at longer ranges than the 7.62x39. Ballisticly the 7.62x39 is very close to a 30/30 Winchester and pretty much sucks past 200 yards

I would be willing to spend $1000 tops for a good gun....If your main type of shooting is going to be taget shooting at 200 yards plus. I would reccomend a DPMS Panther Bull 20, so long as you don't plan on carrying it for miles. Bull barrel AR's are heavy

What's with everyone talking about different lowers/uppers/barrels etc.?? Best advice I can give you here is register on this forum and study for the 2 weeks straight http://www.ar15.com/forums/b/3_AR_15.html

Good Luck

[thunderoussilence]

Spikes is another 7.62 that is good. Pretty often on this board someone will be selling

Good Luck.

Declan

[PhilaBOR]

ABCD
Major production manufacturers:
Armalite
Bushmaster
Colt
DPMS (some would argue with that)

Plus a universe of high end manufacturers and small customizers.

Pros and cons on every round you mentioned. 7.62 x 39 and 5.56/.223 are dirt cheap and available all over. .308 has a lot more oomph but you'll pay more for the gun. Google "best caliber .223" and spend a few hours reading. On the other hand, .223 is the original and most common caliber for AR's. What do you want to hunt? Coyotes and prairie dogs? .223 is fine. It's underpowered for deer and not really suitable for anything larger.

[shooter115]

.

Pros and cons on every round you mentioned. 7.62 x 39 and 5.56/.223 are dirt cheap and available all over. .308 has a lot more oomph but you'll pay more for the gun. Google "best caliber .223" and spend a few hours reading. On the other hand, .223 is the original and most common caliber for AR's. What do you want to hunt? Coyotes and prairie dogs? .223 is fine. It's underpowered for deer and not really suitable for anything larger.

Actually if you're a handloader the 70 grain Berger VLD in a 1-8" twist or better barrel is good medicine on deer out to 300 yards. Maybe a mute point though, I'm pretty sure the OP doesn't roll his own.

Just sayin....

[farmerj]

you'll find there are as many opinions on AR's as there are people who talk about AR's.

You can find a good one as cheap as $500-600 used sometimes or even assemble your own for that price range. It will easily fit the bill for what you want to do.

Some here have been known to toss out a free class or two for some fun time learning hands-on both on-range and in a class room setting on a rare occasion. Some will even arrange a range time so you can actually shoot their AR's to try em out.

There are cheaper and more accurate ways to get a paper puncher and varmint rifle, but it's about one of the best semi-auto's available to do the job.

[UnaStamus]

If you want to go with an AR platform, you need to get familiar with all of the intricacies of the platform. AR15.com and M4Carbine.net are the two best sites to get on to find everything you want to know about ARs. Spend a decent amount of time researching the difference between a carbine gas system and a midlength gas system.

Here's the Cliff's Notes in relation to your questions:

The "Best" brand is highly subjective to the user and the current market. 5 years ago, Colt was the undisputed King. Now you have companies that have surpassed Colt for innovation, options and features. Colt is still good, but it would be inaccurate to say that there is one brand that stands above the rest.
Colt, Noveske, Bravo Company Mfg, Knight Arms, Daniel Defense, LMT, LaRue Tactical, the list goes on. The key is to find a rifle that has a reputation for reliability, durability, and more than anything, consistency with build quality.

For ~$1000 for the rifle, you have several options.
Colt 6920
Sig Sauer M400
S&W M&P15
Spikes Tactical ST-15
Rock River Arms Entry models
Armalite M-15


All AR rifles owned by Cerberus/Freedom Group (DPMS, Bushmaster, Remington) essentially use DPMS components for most of the parts. DPMS has absolutely terrible Quality Control and Quality Assurance. They produce a lot of parts and they don't sufficiently check to ensure that everything is in spec. Every time I go to firearms training courses or other related training, I run into cops and LE agencies that have been screwed by DPMS. I'm not talking about bad prices either. A major metro county SWAT team got new DPMS rifles and ALL of the springs were bad. All of them. Another agency got DPMS AP4 carbines for their squad cars, and on the first range day, the rifles literally started falling apart; extractors, ejectors, pins, the works. Two agencies I've talked to have received bolt carriers that were not chrome-lined. When they sent the BCGs back, DPMS just replaced the gas rings and said they were fixed. A quick check revealed no chrome lining inside the BCG, yet again. A lot of companies use DPMS small parts, but they do a lot of QC/QA inspection on the parts prior to accepting them. Those companies wind up sending a lot of rejected stock back to DPMS. So basically, stay away from DPMS, Bushmaster and Remington. The first AR I bought was a DPMS eons ago when they were still halfway decent. I have replaced half of the components on that rifle, which should not be necessary.
I know DPMS is a Minnesota company, and I always get flamed for saying this because you can't bash DPMS in Minnesota. I still do, because I've read the armorer reports and talked to the other LE armorers around the state.
The reason why I bring this up is because outwardly, DPMS rifles do appear to be very affordable. You get a lot of rifle and options for what you pay. The rifle barrels that DPMS has built by other companies are typically very accurate. However, people tend to mistake accuracy for quality, and mistake affordability for real value.

Several people shoot 7.62x39 ARs, but if you want to shoot that cartridge, the AR is not the platform for it. The cartridge has a high amount of taper, and this causes a bolt thrust issue that causes feeding malfunctions and results in much higher instances of damage to the bolt. It's better to stick with a 5.56mm rifle and be able to shoot it more reliably. Steel case .223 ammo is nearly the same cost as steel case 7.62x39, so if cost is a concern, you can still come out without issue by using steel case ammo instead of brass case (just invest in an extra extractor to keep in your range bag). If you really want to shoot the 7.62x39, get yourself an AK variant. They were made for the 7.62x39; the AR wasn't. The fact that the 7.62x39 is a heavier cartridge is irrelevant for most people, since they use their ARs for range shooting.
If it's a hunting issue for needing heavier rounds, you should be considering a more appropriate cartridge like the 6.8SPC, 6.5 Grendel, .300AAC Blackout, or a .308.


The talk about different lowers and uppers is that the AR is sectioned into two components. The Upper Receiver group and the Lower Receiver group. The Upper houses the upper receiver, bolt carrier group, barrel, gas system, handguards, sights, optics and muzzle device. The Lower houses the trigger and hammer assembly, safety, magazine release, bolt catch/release, grip and buttstock assembly. You can buy one lower and then buy or build multiple uppers to use your rifle for whatever you want. You can also completely custom build your rifle from the ground-up with every specific component that you want.
With that said, I would highly recommend that you stay away from building your first rifle. You can have one built for you, or have someone knowledgeable assist you with building one, but going at it on your own without having the knowledge about the platform will be problematic. I spend a lot of time cleaning up mistakes people make when building their rifles. Shoddy components, parts installed incorrectly, wrong torque specs, wrong parts used, parts incompatibility, etc. As a general belief, I think that the novice AR buyer should buy a completed rifle. Keep it simple. Crawl, walk, then run.
That's just my $0.02.

[Anokamnman]

Well I can't say I am an expert on this, topic. But I can say that if this is a rifle you want to use for hunting deer, you need to look at the.308/7.62x51 NATO. Yes it is, a little more pricey for the rifle. But they can still be had for $1k or less. And the ammo isn't too expensive. I bought a can of surplus ammo the other day. Got 250 rounds for $120. And, you can find it cheaper than that.

I have, a DPMS 308. I take it to the range quite a bit. At least once a week. I would be, willing to let you fire it sometime. As far as options... Its all preference.

[rugersol]

I realize yer not lookin' to build ... yet ... but these might help ya get acquainted with the nomenclature ...

I thought the Cheaper than Dirt videos were purdy good ... I'd install the selector as I install the trigger, though ... might not go in, otherwise ...

[Cuda66]

I would recommend taking a look here:

http://palmettostatearmory.com/

I've heard good things about these guys; never bought any of their uppers, but I've bought parts & ammo, and been happy with them. You could buy a complete lower, and an upper in the configuration you like...quite likely under your $1k limit.

[Scott Notaeh]

Keep it simple. Crawl, walk, then run.
That's just my $0.02.

I came to respond to your questions but UnaStamus has everything right. Read his post closely.

There is a great list of AR features to look for here:
https://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key ... utput=html

[OldmanFCSA]

ABCD
On the other hand, .223 is the original and most common caliber for AR's.

Correction - the 7.62x51/308Win in the AR-10 was the original caliber for AR's.
TRUE = "On the other hand, .223 is the" ... "most common caliber for AR's."


But everything else said in all the posts is true - READ & LEARN.

I have many AR-15's in many variants,
I have a AR in 7.62X39 and love it for its intended purpose.
I have an AR-10 in A2 config and love the firepower.

I wish I had a flattop AR-10 to fit my ArmaLite, in 7mm-08 Rem.
I wish I had a flattop AR-10 to fit my ArmaLite, in 260 Rem.
I wish I had a flattop AR-10 to fit my ArmaLite, in 243 Win.
I wish I had a flattop AR-10 to fit my ArmaLite, in 308 Win.

[Sledaddict82]

I really appreciate all the input so far guys. I've already learned more than I knew before. Apparently there's an AR (not sure on brand yet) at a certain shop called ****** **** that is for sale, asking $650 but I have a slight "in" and could maybe get it for $550. Good deal? I haven't seen it yet but a coworker of mine said he checked it out and it's a nice gun. It's complete. Looks just like a Colt M4. He told me what brand lower was on it but I can't remember the name. What would you guys do in my situation? I'm a college student and my parents would probably kill me if I brought an AR home (which they also said before I bought my Glock hahaha) idk if I need an AR right now but if it's a good enough deal then maybe...
Also, Scheels has a Dpms lo pro classic with Barska electro sight on it for $879, how good of a price is that?

Any of you guys have any for sale? Let me know.

Again, I appreciate the input, if I wasn't so busy all the time I could probably sit down and figure out all this info on my own but I figured it'd be faster just to ask. I still have a lot to learn tho. Thanks.

[shooter115]

Not having any idea what you are buying I would pass on the $650 AR.

In my book, cheap optics add nothing to the value of a firearm and $850 for the Lo-Pro isn't a great deal even if it is brand new.

Like I said before your best bet is to go to AR15.com and do a ton of research. Everything you could ever want to know about the AR is there and if it isn't just ask. That said take the info you get off any of the forums with a grain of salt. There are a lot of very opinionated people out there and while some know exactly what they are talking about, some are totally talking out of their ass. You almost have to gather a sort of average

[farmerj]

get the details on the $650 AR and post it here. (maker name, etc)

And there's no reason you can't get one for that cheap.