300 Ham'R

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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Erud on Mon Dec 09, 2019 7:14 am

Holland&Holland wrote:That goes without saying Ghost.

But what I meant was while the 300 bo did mimic the 300 whisper and both can generally be shot from the same chamber the whisper predated standardization and therefore that statement is not exclusively true.


While it may not be “exclusively” true, it is for all intents and purposes, actually true, isn’t it? There are really no differences that result in any performance Improvements, are there?
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Ghost on Mon Dec 09, 2019 7:31 am

I think the whisper is still technically a wildcat as it is not Saami.

Their interchangeability is similar to .223 and 5.56, most probably can and some you probably shouldn’t.

But let’s get back to the 300BLK +P version
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby crbutler on Mon Dec 09, 2019 3:02 pm

The cases are the same.

Throating of the chamber is minimally different.

Yes, the Whisper is a proprietary cartridge owned by JD Jones of SSK. He refused to allow others to copy it (not sure of the particulars... probably money) and the Blackout is to the Whisper as the Grendel is to the .264 LBC. Minor chamber differences to avoid paying royalties. AAC did standardize through SAAMI.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby crbutler on Mon Dec 09, 2019 3:09 pm

As to “”.300 BLK +P”, what I did is technically not, as it was loading data published by a bullet manufacturer for the cartridge.

It shows multiple points of evidence that it is overpressure (flat primer, mild ejector imprint, and is producing more velocity than it should) but it’s not a formal +P- rather, I decided in risk/benefit to use it. I’m not RECOMMENDING that anyone else do so- but personally I don’t think it’s any more unsafe than a .300 Ham’r, even though that gets less pressure and a modestly heavier bullet to the same endpoint.

That’s partially why I tend to refer to mine as a .300 Whisper- it’s a semantic argument that means I’m doing what I want, not following the rules.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Ghost on Mon Dec 09, 2019 3:17 pm

crbutler wrote:As to “”.300 BLK +P”, what I did is technically not, as it was loading data published by a bullet manufacturer for the cartridge.

It shows multiple points of evidence that it is overpressure (flat primer, mild ejector imprint, and is producing more velocity than it should) but it’s not a formal +P- rather, I decided in risk/benefit to use it. I’m not RECOMMENDING that anyone else do so- but personally I don’t think it’s any more unsafe than a .300 Ham’r, even though that gets less pressure and a modestly heavier bullet to the same endpoint.

That’s partially why I tend to refer to mine as a .300 Whisper- it’s a semantic argument that means I’m doing what I want, not following the rules.

I was only referring to the hamr as the 300 blk +p because that’s what it seems like it is. Nothing shot with it would know the difference.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Holland&Holland on Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:34 pm

Ghost wrote:I think the whisper is still technically a wildcat as it is not Saami.

Their interchangeability is similar to .223 and 5.56, most probably can and some you probably shouldn’t.

But let’s get back to the 300BLK +P version


Correct.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Holland&Holland on Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:35 pm

Erud wrote:
Holland&Holland wrote:That goes without saying Ghost.

But what I meant was while the 300 bo did mimic the 300 whisper and both can generally be shot from the same chamber the whisper predated standardization and therefore that statement is not exclusively true.


While it may not be “exclusively” true, it is for all intents and purposes, actually true, isn’t it? There are really no differences that result in any performance Improvements, are there?


Yes to your 1st question and no to your 2nd.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Holland&Holland on Mon Dec 09, 2019 9:44 pm

Ghost wrote:
crbutler wrote:As to “”.300 BLK +P”, what I did is technically not, as it was loading data published by a bullet manufacturer for the cartridge.

It shows multiple points of evidence that it is overpressure (flat primer, mild ejector imprint, and is producing more velocity than it should) but it’s not a formal +P- rather, I decided in risk/benefit to use it. I’m not RECOMMENDING that anyone else do so- but personally I don’t think it’s any more unsafe than a .300 Ham’r, even though that gets less pressure and a modestly heavier bullet to the same endpoint.

That’s partially why I tend to refer to mine as a .300 Whisper- it’s a semantic argument that means I’m doing what I want, not following the rules.

I was only referring to the hamr as the 300 blk +p because that’s what it seems like it is. Nothing shot with it would know the difference.


I do agree with you but many a new cartridge has come to life chasing a couple of hundred feet per second more.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Ghost on Mon Dec 09, 2019 10:05 pm

I don’t think you’ll see ar10 performance out of the ar15
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby crbutler on Tue Dec 10, 2019 2:30 am

Yes, lots of cartridges have been born looking for feeding a niche.

However, it seems of late that there has been a big glut of them designed to fit in an AR 15, and many seem to be fading.

It looks like the .223; then the .300 BLK/Whisper/whatever you want to call it, the 6.8 SPC and the 6.5 Grendel/LBC are the second tier (mainly due to their applicability for hunting). Maybe the .224 Valkyrie might make a go as it does have a niche with long range shooting, but the Grendel seems to have that covered.

I think the .30 Ham'R is going the way of the .30 remington AR. It fits a niche, but its a very small one, and being proprietary with a cutesie name hurts.

Personally, I have examples of the second tier, but I have no interest in the third. If I am going hog hunting, anything I need to do can be accomplished with a bigger round better than an AR 15 constrained round. (the AR 10 with a suppressor and night vision would be a happy choice if I am culling, but if I am paying the freight most places charge, I'm not plugging 10-15 hogs.) I think I spend more than most on this hobby, and reload for 50+ different rounds, and if I have little interest, its probably a pretty specialized market. If you want one, great, but be aware you might well be buying an orphan.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Bearcatrp on Tue Dec 10, 2019 6:06 am

Finally got a quote for their cheapest 300 Ham'R upper with a 16 inch barrel. $1100.00. Cheapest way to get a 300 Ham'R is buy a barrel (around $200) and do it yourself. As crbutler said above, an AR10 for hog hunting will do the job. Since I have one, going to pass on the 300 Ham'R. Good conversation on the subject folks. Helped me allot. Thanks.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Holland&Holland on Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:21 am

Ghost wrote:I don’t think you’ll see ar10 performance out of the ar15


What? I thought the grendel had that covered?
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Holland&Holland on Tue Dec 10, 2019 7:28 am

crbutler wrote:Yes, lots of cartridges have been born looking for feeding a niche.

However, it seems of late that there has been a big glut of them designed to fit in an AR 15, and many seem to be fading.

It looks like the .223; then the .300 BLK/Whisper/whatever you want to call it, the 6.8 SPC and the 6.5 Grendel/LBC are the second tier (mainly due to their applicability for hunting). Maybe the .224 Valkyrie might make a go as it does have a niche with long range shooting, but the Grendel seems to have that covered.

I think the .30 Ham'R is going the way of the .30 remington AR. It fits a niche, but its a very small one, and being proprietary with a cutesie name hurts.

Personally, I have examples of the second tier, but I have no interest in the third. If I am going hog hunting, anything I need to do can be accomplished with a bigger round better than an AR 15 constrained round. (the AR 10 with a suppressor and night vision would be a happy choice if I am culling, but if I am paying the freight most places charge, I'm not plugging 10-15 hogs.) I think I spend more than most on this hobby, and reload for 50+ different rounds, and if I have little interest, its probably a pretty specialized market. If you want one, great, but be aware you might well be buying an orphan.


Definitely the bo has that kind of availability but I would say .458 socom, 50 beo, .450 bushy are pretty established as well. Also plenty of 9 mms and .22s out there.

4th tier is where it is at though. Wildcats rule!
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby Ghost on Tue Dec 10, 2019 8:19 am

Holland&Holland wrote:
Ghost wrote:I don’t think you’ll see ar10 performance out of the ar15


What? I thought the grendel had that covered?

Grendel has bridged the gap but my 6.5CM does more than my 6.5G ever will.
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Re: 300 Ham'R

Postby yukonjasper on Tue Dec 10, 2019 8:47 am

:o :o :(
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