AR pistol

[FJ540]

The carry permit for anything other than a pistol hasn't been tried in court yet. Feel free to be the test case. The reality is that you'd need to allow a trunk search for them to find it, or have a warrant, so chances of getting caught are slim.

That it's not a rifle could get you around the slug zone rule too, but you'd be relying on a warden not knowing this facet of the law, or possibly even caring.

Wardens are just like any other cop to the extent they have pet peeves. You might encounter one that checks you're using soft points but doesn't care your over length. Then again, they might disagree with using .223 and pull out a tape measure to get you on the length because they hate small bore shooters and wish the law didn't change.

It's your call on if you want to risk it. Most folks have never met a warden in the field. I'm on a first name basis with mine.

[jshuberg]

A firearm doesn't need to need to have a stock to be considered a rifle, it's one of several possible characteristics that define a rifle. However shotguns that have never had a stock are not technically shotguns - they need to have had a stock at some point to be considered a shotgun. That's why a "shotgun" that has never had a stock with a barrel length less than 18" is an Any Other Weapon as opposed to a Short Barrel Shotgun.

A stripped lower is neither a rifle or pistol. It is simply a firearm. If at any time a stock is put on it, *or* an upper receiver with a barrel length 16" or greater, *or* the overall length is greater than 26", it becomes a rifle. The same is true of a pistol lower - if a stock, upper or overall length convert it into a rifle, it is now a rifle, regardless of what it originally sold as.

A Short Barrel Rifle is any firearm that has a stock, a barrel length less than 16", or an overall length of less than 26". A machine gun is any weapon that is capable of discharging more than one round per activation of the trigger.

These are the classifications an AR-15 style firearm can be in, from lowest to highest:

Other (Stripped lower)
Pistol
Rifle
Any Other Weapon (Title II)
Short Barrel Rifle (Title II)
Machine gun (Title II)

Once a stripped lower becomes a rifle or pistol, it cannot go back. Once a pistol becomes a rifle, it cannot go back. If you put a 16" upper on your pistol, and then put your pistol upper back on, technically it is no longer a pistol, it's an SBR. I say technically since there is almost no way to prove a pistol had been temporarily converted into a rifle, so from a practical standpoint this is almost impossible to enforce. However, if a firearm was sold as a rifle, it can never be a pistol, and there is a paper trail proving that.

Title II firearms (NFA) are registered with BATFE, and they can be converted back into a Title I firearm (rifle, etc) by contacting BATFE and having the firearm removed from the NFA registry. A registered SBR is always an SBR, even if changed into a configuration that would no longer qualify it as an SBR, unless you notify BATFE and have its legal status changed. If you put a 16" upper on your SBR and loan it to a buddy, he would be in possession of an unregistered (to him) SBR, regardless of the change in configuration.

This stuff can get confusing, and BATFE has reversed itself in the past, so I would suggest contacting the NFA or Technology branch before doing anything that would change a firearms classification.

BATFE NFA branch: (304) 616-4490

[FJ540]

ATF says AR pistols can be configured as rifles and converted back again. There's a couple rulings on this. Arfcom has at least one of them pinned.

[Uffdaphil]

One clarification. If a lower is constructed as a pistol, it can later become a rifle. Just not vice versa. At least that is what I have always read.

Edit: Sheesh, now even that is wrong according to that forum. I guess it's kept cloudy so any of us can end up the hoosegow if Big Brother really wants us there.

[CZscout]

Just because I've been searching, just thought I'd share the "best deal" on pistol uppers that I could find:

Right here in MN:

http://redxarms.com/

[BemidjiDweller]

Just because I've been searching, just thought I'd share the "best deal" on pistol uppers that I could find:

Right here in MN:

http://redxarms.com/

Be careful with those parts, a BCG I ordered was missing parts and the CH that I ordered with it was bent. Took just over a month to get my money back.

[FJ540]

I've got some stuff from them. I won't do that again.

[whiteox]

Not to beat a dead horse here but, if I buy a stripped lower build tot as a pistol with an upper that never exceeds 26" overall length I do not need to register it with BATFE or any state gov authority. It's just a pistol that I made, same as if I built my own 1911.

Right?

[whiteox]

Also, anybody know where I can find a lower build kit for a pistol? Palmetto was sold out.

[CZscout]

General AR Pistol Question -

In your experience with AR Pistols, what is the best option for sights? (red dot, iron etc....)

Thanks!

[FJ540]

If you intend to shoulder it, A1 or A2 rear iron's are too close to my eye to focus through, but if shooting it double handed like a handgun they work surprisingly well.

As a PDW, sights aren't needed IMO.

If I ever hunt with it, I'll be adding a rail to my FF handguard and putting a dot on it.

[TTS]

Not to beat a dead horse here but, if I buy a stripped lower build tot as a pistol with an upper that never exceeds 26" overall length I do not need to register it with BATFE or any state gov authority. It's just a pistol that I made, same as if I built my own 1911.

Right?

Has nothing to do with the OAL, it is legal as long as you build it as a pistol first, virgin receiver - no stock. You would only need to get the ATF involved if you wanted to make it an SBR.

[whiteox]

Managed to put one together for a hair over $500 (not counting some parts I already had laying around)

Barrel $192.00 http://www.midwayusa.com/product/271848/ar-stoner-barrel-ar-15-pistol-300-aac-blackout-1-in-8-twist-105-stainless-steel?cm_cat=CheckoutConfirm&cm_pla=ProductDescrip

Roll Pin $1.99 http://www.midwayusa.com/product/227094/dpms-bolt-catch-roll-pin-ar-15?cm_cat=CheckoutConfirm&cm_pla=ProductDescrip + code 201213 to get $20 off.

Complete Lower / No Stock $119.00 http://fatboytactical.net/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=21&products_id=450

Complete Upper $89.00 http://fatboytactical.net/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=31&products_id=199

Pistol Buffer Tube Assembly $54.95 Got the last one apparently. http://fatboytactical.net/cart/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=3

Pistol Gas Tube $12.95 - http://fatboytactical.net/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=41_12&products_id=142

Low Profile Gas Block $23.95 http://fatboytactical.net/cart/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=41_12&products_id=141

I had a free float carbine handguard and a .300 blackout flash hider sitting around. I'll borrow the bcg and charging handle from my rifle for the moment.

Total with shipping came to $501.85.

Here's where I got the lead on all the parts. http://www.arpartsfinder.com/

[67camaro]

FYI it isn't advised to use the same bolt in different barrels. I would have no problem using the same carrier with different bolts. Please ask more questions if needed.

[whiteox]

I'm guessing this is because of possible headspace issues?

Is it "not advised" or unsafe?