9 luger defensive ammo

[CueBall]

if you dont want your target to get back up...ever, try rbcd performance plus tpd 9mm. im not going to get into specifics so just youtube rbcd for some interesting videos.

[goalie]

OK, duly noted but most of us in their daily existence cannot have the infantry/or other backup ready to pull their bacon out of the fire. We have to make do with what we have and a handgun better than a knife or empty hand. We all have to make do with what we have available. I’m not saying, I’m just saying…

And my point is that most people spend more time worrying about what ammo they should have in their gun than getting in good enough shape to actually improve their lives and likelihood of survival.

No matter what handgun you've got in your hand, it's still a handgun.....

[Pinnacle]

if you dont want your target to get back up...ever, try rbcd performance plus tpd 9mm. im not going to get into specifics so just youtube rbcd for some interesting videos.

Goalie is 100% RIGHT

A handgun is a marginal tool and that is all there is to it - it is not a death ray - it is a marginal tool. A rifle or shotgun is the weapon of choice if I KNOW that there is a fight coming. Pistols are handy that's all..

[CueBall]

i agree, being in shape is much more important and unfortunately the least adhered to survival basics'. with that said, i was trying to give the op some ideas on carry ammo. one thing i failed to touch upon is that some jurors and prosecutors tend to look at hollow points with serious disadain. while the ammo i mentioned isnt hollowpoint im sure it will cause substantially more grief in the same situation, so take it for what its worth.

[Joat]

Thanks JFettig, that's the info I needed, from other reading the some CZ compacts don't like 147 grain rounds, mine hasn't hiccuped with the WWB 147's but who knows with a different brand. I don't really want to put up with extra recoil if I don't gain in penetration, so I guess I'll have to pickup a box of each, and try them out at the range.

[justaguy]

if you dont want your target to get back up...ever, try rbcd performance plus tpd 9mm. im not going to get into specifics so just youtube rbcd for some interesting videos.

Goalie is 100% RIGHT

A handgun is a marginal tool and that is all there is to it - it is not a death ray - it is a marginal tool. A rifle or shotgun is the weapon of choice if I KNOW that there is a fight coming. Pistols are handy that's all..

Rifles and shotguns aren't 100% either. They are not death rays, so I would call them marginal.

[westberg]

Goalie is 100% RIGHT

A handgun is a marginal tool and that is all there is to it - it is not a death ray - it is a marginal tool. A rifle or shotgun is the weapon of choice if I KNOW that there is a fight coming. Pistols are handy that's all..

Rifles and shotguns aren't 100% either. They are not death rays, so I would call them marginal.

Well is there a particular brand of death ray you would recommend

[Pinnacle]

Goalie is 100% RIGHT

A handgun is a marginal tool and that is all there is to it - it is not a death ray - it is a marginal tool. A rifle or shotgun is the weapon of choice if I KNOW that there is a fight coming. Pistols are handy that's all..

Rifles and shotguns aren't 100% either. They are not death rays, so I would call them marginal.

Well is there a particular brand of death ray you would recommend

Yes as stated millions of times - winchester ranger 127+P+ 9mm...

Or a 1oz rifled slug in 12ga

[Ironbear]

Thanks JFettig, that's the info I needed, from other reading the some CZ compacts don't like 147 grain rounds, mine hasn't hiccuped with the WWB 147's but who knows with a different brand.

I don't really have any specific references, but I was under the impression that many of the police departments that joined the 147 grain (subsonic) 9mm fad, got away from them quickly as they were dissatisfied with the performance. Anybody have any real references that yay or nay that?

[Stradawhovious]

Well is there a particular brand of death ray you would recommend

Electrolux.

[Pinnacle]

if you dont want your target to get back up...ever, try rbcd performance plus tpd 9mm. im not going to get into specifics so just youtube rbcd for some interesting videos.

Goalie is 100% RIGHT

A handgun is a marginal tool and that is all there is to it - it is not a death ray - it is a marginal tool. A rifle or shotgun is the weapon of choice if I KNOW that there is a fight coming. Pistols are handy that's all..

Rifles and shotguns aren't 100% either. They are not death rays, so I would call them marginal.

5.56 COM is about a 99% fight stopper
7.62x51mm is even better

and a 12ga beats 4-aces

[justaguy]

5.56 COM is about a 99% fight stopper
7.62x51mm is even better

and a 12ga beats 4-aces

With what grain bullet, hollow point or ball? Where did you get the 99%?

With all that being said would you want to be shot with any handgun, because they are marginal?

We are dealing with reality here. You cant carry a 12ga or a 5.56 there is always something better but this is what we have so we have to be realistic. You people like to make it sound like getting shot with a handgun is a joke. With that train of thought you shouldn't worry about the bad guys because they will most likely have a handgun and they are marginal.

I also heard that if a .50cal passes within 18 inches of you it will rip your skin away because of the velocity of the round.
And it is against the Geneva Convention to use them on humans, but you can shoot a canteen on their belt and its ok because you are shooting at gear not the person.

[princewally]

Well is there a particular brand of death ray you would recommend

Electrolux.

Kill-o-Zap


Phaser


Misc bits of shooty ray goodness:

[Pinnacle]

5.56 COM is about a 99% fight stopper
7.62x51mm is even better

and a 12ga beats 4-aces

With what grain bullet, hollow point or ball? Where did you get the 99%?

With all that being said would you want to be shot with any handgun, because they are marginal?

We are dealing with reality here. You cant carry a 12ga or a 5.56 there is always something better but this is what we have so we have to be realistic. You people like to make it sound like getting shot with a handgun is a joke. With that train of thought you shouldn't worry about the bad guys because they will most likely have a handgun and they are marginal.

I also heard that if a .50cal passes within 18 inches of you it will rip your skin away because of the velocity of the round.
And it is against the Geneva Convention to use them on humans, but you can shoot a canteen on their belt and its ok because you are shooting at gear not the person.

99% is a US Army Statistic with M193 - TAP and Rem 55JHP's are even better.

No I would not want to be shot with ANYTHING - but if it were a handgun - I might have a better than average chance of continuing the fight (hence the point of this discussion)

Reality is that handguns are marginal and are not guaranteed to stop a fight with one shot. The main point is that because you have a handgun - dont think that it has the ability to end a fight with one shot. It just does not happen like that. I have seen some pretty interesting cases where someone was shot with a handgun COM and still alive to talk about it as well as continuing the fight after being shot.

Just because you have a $900 handgun that spits $1.50/ea bullets that does not mean that your problem will be solved immediately. If I KNOW a fight is coming (this is where reality is justaguy) I will grab my $200 Rem870 and throw lead at the problem that WILL solve the problem more effecively.

[justaguy]

If I KNOW a fight is coming (this is where reality is justaguy) I will grab my $200 Rem870 and throw lead at the problem that WILL solve the problem more effecively.

If you KNOW a fight is coming wouldn't a better reality be to be sick that day or somewhere else when that happens? IANAL but that's what I would hope if I knew a fight was coming.

I thought the OP wanted to know good 9mm rounds not what rifle rounds could do, or how in effective handguns were.