Vests?

[Squib Joe]

Joe, they show it stopping all those rounds, however, how is the transfer of energy handled?

I'm no expert, but to put it in scientific terms, even if the bullet penetration is stopped it is going to hurt like a mofo

[gyrfalcon]

...I'm no expert, but to put it in scientific terms, even if the bullet penetration is stopped it is going to hurt like a mofo

Technically the absorption of energy can be distributed to the same level that the shooter felt on their shoulder, or even less than that. The hard panels generally distribute the energy quite well, but you run into issues with spalling. If you're shot with .300 Win Mag or 7.62x54 in the chest you're going to feel it regardless of how well the armor disperses the energy because there's a lot of it to go around.

When the MOA first opened they had a securtiy store that sold vests, shirts and other stuff with Kevlar.

What store was this?

[plblark]

The Security Store? I seem to remember that one didn't last too long.

[gyrfalcon]

The Security Store? I seem to remember that one didn't last too long.

You're right, I must have missed it since I haven't gone to the mall for a long time:

Some stores at the Mall of America have had their business hurt by the teen-age crowd. One is the Security Store, which sells personal security items on the first floor, near a stage where families, most of them white (WTF?), gather by day to hear storytellers or children's songs.

[Hammer99...]

Regardless. They aren't going to get in, and then to where the people are sleeping faster than you'll wake up after the door gets kicked off its hinges and the dogs go nuts.

Hell, the dogs will go nuts before the door gets kicked.

If they can get in so fast or so quiet you can't react, either you neglected some portion of security procedures, you are using substandard materials and hardware to construct your house, or they are so highly skilled and trained that it's a foregone conclusion anyways.

And in the event that you don't have time to don a vest, you are in the same position you were when you didn't have a vest.

Decide that a vest might not be a cost effective choice for you if you so choose (in fact, that's the decision I've made personally, at this point in my life), but to argue that protective gear provides no benefit is asinine.

Are you implying that I said "protective gear provides no benefit"? Because I never said that. What I said was "It's hard to see what it role is". And I mean that strictly in the context of home defense.

I'm not that smart but I'm smart enough to know that a good plan involves assuming nothing goes the way I planed it.

[Snowgun]

Some stores at the Mall of America have had their business hurt by the teen-age crowd. One is the Security Store, which sells personal security items on the first floor, near a stage where families, most of them white (WTF?), gather by day to hear storytellers or children's songs.

This is hilarious!

[Pinnacle]

2. Wear what you carry What do you mean by this?
7. Store the vest FLAT - don't hang it. Curious why this is, though I think I can guess..
8. Buy an additional carrier, you will need it. Could you expound on this?

This is a great document from that site you linked:

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/223054.pdf

1. If you carry a handgun that is an NIJ2 type classified threat, wear a level 2 vest
2. Hanging causes bunching and can damage the edges of a vest degrading protection to the diamond stitch In aramid and can ruin a poly vest.
3. Yup you will damage a carrier, wear it out, or it will stink have an extra. You have more than one pair of underpants for the same reason.

Where have I been? Avoiding abject stupidity and cooling my heels. Thought I could be of use here on this topic.

Guys this is what I do all day. Armor of all sorts. You want to stop rifles? Good luck......ain't going to happen in a practical manner for a civilian trying to be discrete. Too expensive too heavy and too thick.

[Snowgun]

2. Wear what you carry What do you mean by this?
7. Store the vest FLAT - don't hang it. Curious why this is, though I think I can guess..
8. Buy an additional carrier, you will need it. Could you expound on this?

This is a great document from that site you linked:

https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/nij/223054.pdf

1. If you carry a handgun that is an NIJ2 type classified threat, wear a level 2 vest
2. Hanging causes bunching and can damage the edges of a vest degrading protection to the diamond stitch In aramid and can ruin a poly vest.
3. Yup you will damage a carrier, wear it out, or it will stink have an extra. You have more than one pair of underpants for the same reason.
.

Thanks for the info Pinnacle, your experience is appreciated as always.

You want to stop rifles? Good luck......ain't going to happen in a practical manner for a civilian trying to be discrete. Too expensive too heavy and too thick

SERPENTINE PEOPLE! MOVE SERPENTINE!

[Squib Joe]

SERPENTINE PEOPLE! MOVE SERPENTINE!

HE'S INCAPABLE OF RAPID COURSE CORRECTION!

[tman]

2. Hanging causes bunching and can damage the edges of a vest degrading protection to the diamond stitch In aramid and can ruin a poly vest.

Of course! I need to be lying down at work to keep my kevlar from bunching around my stomach!

[demonsnow143]

Great information shared. Protective vest equipment are best for security reasons.

[dsm2nr]

It's a small vest, but it's a IIIa small vest. Beats the ever loving **** out of a surplus "flack jacket" which generally won't stop lvl II threats.

IMO, though, if you're gonna have a "grab vest" for emergency situations, you might as well put a hard armor plate in it, it's not like you have to conceal it, so you might as well make it a true lvl III or lvl IV vest.

Though their "Airsave" lvl IV hard armor carrier is twice the price, so I guess I can see their desire to diversify, and the Defender is a plate carrier, so you could always add the plate later.

I agree with him. Even if the plate costs twice as much, who cares when it's supposed to stop a bullet. Save for another few weeks. Although I won't be grabbing any kind of vest / plate carrier if something happens while I'm sleeping, like depicted with the girl. Time critical is time critical.

[Pinnacle]

It's a small vest, but it's a IIIa small vest. Beats the ever loving **** out of a surplus "flack jacket" which generally won't stop lvl II threats.

IMO, though, if you're gonna have a "grab vest" for emergency situations, you might as well put a hard armor plate in it, it's not like you have to conceal it, so you might as well make it a true lvl III or lvl IV vest.

Though their "Airsave" lvl IV hard armor carrier is twice the price, so I guess I can see their desire to diversify, and the Defender is a plate carrier, so you could always add the plate later.

I agree with him. Even if the plate costs twice as much, who cares when it's supposed to stop a bullet. Save for another few weeks. Although I won't be grabbing any kind of vest / plate carrier if something happens while I'm sleeping, like depicted with the girl. Time critical is time critical.

GUYS STOP STOP STOP STOP STOP - WHOA

You had better know what you are buying before you spend the coin on plates. There are several different kinds and several different purposes for them. You need to know what the heck you are loloking at before you do ANYTHING.

For example - there are plates that are Labeled NIJ4 - but WONT STOP that threat, or much of anything else for that matter without NIJ3A Soft Armor Under it. There are plates that are NIJ3 that wont defeat all NIJ3 Type Classified threats (M193 for Example) - And then there are plates that will work well - but NOT within 2" of the edge FULL CIRCUMFERENCE.

Dont buy it unless you know what it is. Ask and I will assist as I can. Dont buy someone elses used crap, dont buy surplus (because that is STOLEN US ARMY PROPERTY) There are no Surplus ESAPI Plates... PERIOD.

[Norsesmithy]

This is a good point, however, most reputable armor sellers make sure to include all this information, and there are several armor sources that encourage you several times before you are able to purchase to contact them directly so that they can talk you though the selection of the correct items from their inventory.

Not to mention that there are reputable local businesses who can help a person so interested.

[gyrfalcon]

... dont buy surplus (because that is STOLEN US ARMY PROPERTY) There are no Surplus ESAPI Plates... PERIOD.

While it's technically true the US military doesn't sell surplus plates, you can buy new and used ESAPI plates legally that are not stolen. The Army also charges soldiers for lost body armor so it's not exactly like they can cry too hard about re-sale.