What is a.17 HMR really and is it better than 22lr or 22WMR?

[Snowgun]

So I was lamping at Cabela's today and saw all the cool youth .17HMR rifles they have.

I've been thinking of getting a 22 rifle, one my kids could learn on, and these interested me.

What is the deal? They obviously are more powerful than the 22lr and more expensive, but are they the way to go? Should I just get a 22 WMR?

I was thinking of getting a 10/22, would .17 be an ok caliber? Any experience with this?

[Stradawhovious]

I'm looking to get into a .17HMR for a small varmint rifle. It's a very quick (about 2,400 fps), flat shooting round that can be really acurate to 100+ yards. 1 MOA or better kind of accurate. Unlike the .22

For a kids plinker, I would get a .22. Much, much less expensive to shoot. FOr one hell of a squirel and rabbit gun I'd get the .17 HMR.

[usnret]

22LR = cheap to shoot
17 Mach II = expensive to shoot $5.00 - $6.00 per box

22Mag = expensive to shoot $6.00 - $8.00 per box
17HMR = expensive to shoot $10.00 - $17.00 per box

[RAGGED]

In my honest opinion the HMR is a better hunting rifle than a plinker, I wouldn’t even compare a 22lr with a HMR because of ammo cost, also unlike 22’s which seem to shoot no matter what my HMR’s seem to get rather picky if the bbl is dirty, another issue if you were looking for a plinker. That said I do love them and they are accurate and powerful, they are an excellent choice for taking critters at 150yds or more, something a 22lr and 22wmr would struggle with. I enjoy the accuracy of the HMR over the 22wmr, and I’ve always liked rounds that carry their energy with high speed vs. high bullet weight.

As for what to get, I could see getting frustrated trying to feed ($$) and clean up after the HMR, if your kid shoots anything like I did when I was young, the WMR is just as much money and lacks some of the other cool factors of the HMR, I’d likely just stick with a good ol 22lr. 10/22’s are great fun but for a kid I may be tempted to go with a nice quality bolt gun, like a CZ, I know I always had the most fun with n old Remington target 22 with Lyman sights, its always fun for kids when they actually hit things consistently!

[SparkyJeff]

I'm going to go ahead and suggest getting one of each.

That $100 after rebate Marlin 795 is a no brainer.

for a kid I may be tempted to go with a nice quality bolt gun, like a CZ,

RAGGED suggested a CZ bolt action, he clearly knows what he is talking about. Excellent rifle, with probably the best factory iron sights around.

I've never shot a .17 But I have more than one .22LR CZ rifle, and I really enjoy it when I shoot a one hole 5 shot group with one. (It rarely happens, but when it does, It feels REALLY good)

[cobb]

I think the best bet for the kids is a regular old .22 rimfire. Cheapest to shoot and to learn the basics on, can still be used for hunting small game. On the list that usnret posted, I do not have a 17HMR, won one at a banquet and sold it. That caliber just doesn't trip my trigger, I would instead opt for a .17 Remginton that shoots flatter and I can reload. I had to look hard to find a Mach II, this is in a CZ 452 American and I like it alot, at a 100 yards and under it does an excellent job. I have a CZ 455 in .22 rimfire mag, another sweet rifle but have it only because it was again something I won and decided it was too nice to sell. I have a CZ 452 Ultra Lux in .22 rimfire that I have exterminated countless problems, basically my go to problem solver. The last is a Ruger 10-22, I think just about everyone owns one, many accessories and upgradable parts, hard to beat. But if you are looking for a kids rifle, I would check into a bolt action which is made by several companies and won't break the bank. For kids I think the semi's are too tempting for them to make them go bang fast. A bolt is not as tempting to shoot fast and I think better for them to work on the basics.

[LarryFlew]

17HMR is now my favorite overall rounds. 2 inch rapid fire groups are easy at 100 yards. Usually are bolt guns. If you want semi auto there are 2 mfgs and they start at just over a grand. MIne is a semi made by Volguartson of IA. the other semi is made in MN.

[RAGGED]

17HMR is now my favorite overall rounds. 2 inch rapid fire groups are easy at 100 yards. Usually are bolt guns. If you want semi auto there are 2 mfgs and they start at just over a grand. MIne is a semi made by Volguartson of IA. the other semi is made in MN.

The Magnum Research HMR semis are crap, I know two people that had them and both were bought back as they never worked right, they may not even make them anymore.

[smurfman]

I have several 22 LRs, a 22 mag, and a 17 HMR. For teaching others the basics of rifle shooting, the 22 LR is the way to go. Cost for the rifle and ammo is as reasonable as one can find which allows for plenty of practice. With a bit of care one can find a particular brand and/or lot of ammo which provides great accuracy but that is not really all that important for beginners. The 22 LR is also a gret small game round out to 70+ yards though it can be kind of tricky at that range and more. Meat loss is very minimal due to low velocity and reasonable bullet expansion if one is using hollow points. The greatest gripe against the 22 LR is the risk of ricocette is the greatest for the same mentioned velocity reason. The hyper velocity rounds are not as bad but I did hear them whizzing off more than was comfortable.
The 22 mag is a more robust round which I use for critters larger than about 10 pounds. It is a bit hard on edible animals but it cam be a bit hard at typical 22 LR distances. It is the minimum I use for coyotes and then I keep ranges under 100 yards. Ammo is much more than for the 22 LR, $8 a box of 50 is about the least expensive I have found. Ricochettes are about the same as with the 22 LR unless the hyper velocity rounds are used and even then they do occur. Accuracy is not as great as with the 22 LR with comparable lines but it has been accurate enough for its purposes.
The 17 HMR I bought to use on ground squirrels as the chance of ricochettes was much less due to bullet design and velocity. I do not recall hearing a 17 gr V-Max bullet zipping off into the distance after contacting the ground and I have shot more than a thousand rounds of them. I would not use one on edible game as the results on ground squirrels, red squirrels, and prairie dogs have been rather spectacular. The cost of rounds is well past $10/50 though I have seen them as low as $10/50 if bought in 2500 round lots. It is the most accurate of the mentioned rounds but then it has been designed from the ground up for great accuracy as can be seen by the bullet choice.
Again, I recommend the 22 LR for the purpose stated by the OP. It is the best choice in my mind.

[Holland&Holland]

If you do not have a .22 then that is your required next purchase, period. Since your first question whas what is a .17 HMR and no one seems to have answered it, it is a .22WMR rimfire necked down to .17. It out perfroms the .22WMR if you are looking for velocity and flat shooting however .22WMR will give you a heavier projectile and if you know your trajectory one can compensate accordingly. It is not a bad round but neither is a plinker, that is reserved for the .22lr. Another nice thing about the .22WMR is that it gives .22LR velocity out of a handgun barrel. I have a .22WMR revolver that is my trail gun when ever I am out grouse hunting or the like, very handy to have to add a squirrel to the pot.

.22WMR will generaly give you 40 grains at about 1900 fps (I kind of think of it as the .22 worlds .45-70, with coons and such being "big game")

.17 HMR will give 17 grain Vmax at 2550 (IMHO whoopdy doo!) if I wanted a varmint round to explode something at distance I would pull out the .223, if I really wanted distance then I am pulling out my .220 Swift, but I suppose if 150 is your max yardage go for it. Don't get me wrong, I am always for buying a gun just because and if money grew on trees I would have one of every one ever made, but just have not found a reason to add the .17 HMR to the stable. Too many centerfires that can do the job better I think.

.17 Mach 2 BTW is a .22 LR necked to .17, hornady vmax 17 gr at 2100, now you are really in the why territory I think.


Still no substitute for the good old .22lr. So very versitile, so very cheap, and can be so very accurate.

[LarryFlew]

The Magnum Research HMR semis are crap, I know two people that had them and both were bought back as they never worked right, they may not even make them anymore.

That's why I didn't give them the free advertising Did just check their site and it appears they no longer sell the 17HMR.

Forgot to mention I also have a scoped revolver in 17HMR that is a lot of fun to shoot. I do however agree with all of the statements regarding having a 22LR for plinking etc. Just can't beat it for price to shoot etc.

[RAGGED]

.17 Mach 2 BTW is a .22 LR necked to .17, hornady vmax 17 gr at 2100, now you are really in the why territory I think.

I don't know, my single favorite rifle is a 10/22 that has been converted to shoot 17 MACH2, Mach 2's are pretty cheap to shoot, at less than $5/50 ($3.50 when you score) they are much cheaper than 22LR match ammo but delivery better accuracy @ 100yds than most 22LR with uber expensive Eley match rounds ($15-20/50rd). 17M2 is my go to small game rifle, just perfect in my mind.

[Holland&Holland]

.17 Mach 2 BTW is a .22 LR necked to .17, hornady vmax 17 gr at 2100, now you are really in the why territory I think.

I don't know, my single favorite rifle is a 10/22 that has been converted to shoot 17 MACH2, Mach 2's are pretty cheap to shoot, at less than $5/50 ($3.50 when you score) they are much cheaper than 22LR match ammo but delivery better accuracy @ 100yds than most 22LR with uber expensive Eley match rounds ($15-20/50rd). 17M2 is my go to small game rifle, just perfect in my mind.

Well, I am all for more rather than less options, but with my favorite tack driver .22lr I can sit on the 50 yard range all day and plink away at a dime sized group with cheap remington golden bulk packs for $15 for 525 and on a good day do fairly decent at 100 yards as well. Of course I am one who thinks why do we need this new fangled '06 round fer? We all ready got us the .45-70.

[Snowgun]

.17 HMR will give 17 grain Vmax at 2550 (IMHO whoopdy doo!) if I wanted a varmint round to explode something at distance I would pull out the .223,

This made me laugh.

.17 Mach 2 BTW is a .22 LR necked to .17, hornady vmax 17 gr at 2100, now you are really in the why territory I think.

I don't know, my single favorite rifle is a 10/22 that has been converted to shoot 17 MACH2, Mach 2's are pretty cheap to shoot, at less than $5/50 ($3.50 when you score) they are much cheaper than 22LR match ammo but delivery better accuracy @ 100yds than most 22LR with uber expensive Eley match rounds ($15-20/50rd). 17M2 is my go to small game rifle, just perfect in my mind.

I havn't even heard of the mach 2. I looked up this http://www.chuckhawks.com/compared_22LR_17M2.htm and it seems like it's a pretty sweet round.

If I was to buy a bolt action, I would get a nice, heavy barrel one, that has the possibility of a scope mount, so that I could take the kids back to grandpa's in Nodak and smoke prairie dogs. Ragged, or whoever, do you have a good suggestion for this? I would probably want to trick it out with a good trigger, a comp (not needed but hey). Is the Cz still a good lead?

I guess something that I could adjust the stock length would be optimal. I want to get something everyone in the family can use for a long time...

[Snowgun]

On a related topic...

Is it heresy to skip the iron sights training and just start the kid out on a scope?

I learned on both, and honestly, something about looking through that magical tube right up at your target made me want to learn the breathing and trigger control to keep the wiggle down and make that good shot.

I figure when they get older they are going to be using all scopes or red dots anyway, and they can learn iron sights on handguns.