Ripple in 9mm shell

[Mjollnir]

I am new to reloading and I am using a Lee Press and dies. When making 9mm I have used several types of bullets so far, (115 gr Remington and 124 gr Hornady), and I get a ripple in the shell after seating the bullet with no crimp. (I crimp with the fourth die.) The wrinkle appears 2/3 from the bottom of the case where the bottom of the seated bullet is. The wrinkle is also more pronounced on one side. I am using 5cc/ 6.1 grains ofPower Pistol powder.
What is going wrong???

[Stradawhovious]

More than likely not sizing the case appropriately, or not belling the case mouth enough before seting the bullet.

Pics would be a great help in diagnosing your problem.

[Mjollnir]

I'm thinking I got a bad 9mm Lee sizing and depriming die, because I have experimented with changing the case mouth belling when charging the case...

[timwarner]

reloaded 9mm often gets a coke bottle shape to it. Not sure if this is what you are seeing, but it will be wider where the bullet is seated, and narrower just below by a bit.

[Mjollnir]

OK, then I'm just being a perfectionist? Factory ammo is straight and true and that's how I expect my ammo to look. The fact that the wrinkle is more pronounced on one side of the round makes me think the bullet starts out crooked before it starts its path down the barrel.

[Snowgun]

I see the same thing in some of my 9mm. I think it's from the bullet turning in the cartridge as the seater is lining it up. Cosmetic issue.

[rukwikenuf]

I see the same thing in some of my 9mm. I think it's from the bullet turning in the cartridge as the seater is lining it up. Cosmetic issue.

so, is this OK?

[rugersol]

I see the same thing in some of my 9mm. I think it's from the bullet turning in the cartridge as the seater is lining it up. Cosmetic issue.

so, is this OK?

nah. .. that's whack!

ya talkin' base of the bullet? ... 'er further down? ... latter's from resizing bulged brass. .. could do a blowout.

after resizing, no way the case shouldn't otherwise be concentric. .. as should, the bullet.

[Eric Marleau]

You are not putting enough "flange" on the mouth of the casing.

Also, remember, 9mm is not to be crimped.

One more thing. Without looking at my logs when I reloaded with Power Pistol, {which is a great powder for 9mm} it seems that I was dropping just a tad over 5gr.
You might want to look at your books on that one.

Eric

[gyrfalcon]

Also, remember, 9mm is not to be crimped.

9mm can and should be crimped. You don't want to crimp 9mm with a roll crimp though, like all other cartridges that head space off the case mouth.

[Eric Marleau]

When the term "crimp" is used in 9mm reloading, a taper crimp is used on cartridges that are supposed to headspace on the mouth of the cartridge (where the bullet enters the case).
A taper crimp removes the flaring, and actually swages the case against the bullet, while still allowing the case mouth to headspace.


Any crimping should be a taper crimp.

Most reloading books will say no crimping.

I have never crimped 9mm, and have had no feeding problems on many different pistols.

Eric

[Seismic Sam]

Yup, not enough neck flare, and the Lee neck expander dies dies are the crappiest on the market. Plus the taper on the expander is quite sharp, so it takes some experience to set it right. The first 10 mils of the base of the bullet should be able to seat in the expanded mouth of the case with finger pressure. I'd buy a Lee 9mm Type M die for 9mm and use that instead.

Lee Expander die from the factory: Note the rough tool marks on the hardened steel, and it feels gritty as hell when opening up the mouth of the case.



Polished Lee expander die after I got done with it. Much smoother action, but the sharp taper of the expander button still makes it a bitch to adjust.



Lyman Type M die: Note polished surface and a definite two step shoulder which makes case mouth belling much easier.

[rugersol]

ya, I thought 'bout that after I went to bed ... I've crushed a few .380's tryin' to get the right crimp ... not much of a case, there.

I like to set my taper crimp to where I can't push the bullet in between my finger 'n thumb ... then give 'er 'nother 1/8 turn 'er so ... wouldn't take much more to crush it.

... in case yer expander's otherwise not the problem.

[Mjollnir]

Thank you, everybody, for your input. The ammo I'm making feeds through my G19 without a problem, and expands to a normal looking case after firing. If I flare the opening of the case any more, I squish the case. Lee includes a crimping die for their 4-hole turret press, so it should be OK to give 9mm a slight crimp.
BTW, .5 cc's of Power Pistol is about 6.1 grains, same volume as the Lee dipper in the 9mm die set and the suggested starting load for 115 gr bullets. My references suggest a smaller starting load for 124 gr bullets. I wonder what Lee would say?

My caliper says the bullets are 9.02 mm diameter, and the inside of a deprimed and resized case is about 8.5-8 mm on average. What should the inside of a case measure?

So now I have this additional question. Should I seat the bullets as close to the maximum length allowed, 29.69 mm? How much give do I have when taking the bullet nose shape into account?
Thanks again for your expertise.

[Seismic Sam]

Thank you, everybody, for your input. The ammo I'm making feeds through my G19 without a problem, and expands to a normal looking case after firing. If I flare the opening of the case any more, I squish the case. Lee includes a crimping dies for their 4-hole turret press, so it should be OK to give 9mm a slight crimp.
BTW, .5 cc's of Power Pistol is about 6.1 grains, same volume as the Lee dipper in the 9mm die set and the suggested starting load for 115 gr bullets. My references suggest a smaller starting load for 124 gr bullets.

So now I have this question. Should I seat the bullets as close to the maximum length allowed, 29.69 mm? How much give do I have when taking the bullet nose shape into account?
Thanks again for your expertise.

Read your manual, and find out what the OAL is for that bullet shape and weight, or one very similar to it!! That information is plainly stated on the page with each bullet type, so the information you want is right in front of your nose!!

Oh, and did your seating die come with multiple seating stems?? If you use the wrong seating stem, the nose of the bullet and the stem will not match, and that could cant the bullet slightly off center.

And BTW, why are you using millimeters instead of thousandths of an inch for your measurements? If you're using a digital caliper, all you have to do is push the units button and then it will read out in the proper thousandths of an inch.