Exaggerated prices, exaggerated panic.

[Evad]

I have no problem with people making $. Zero. make what you want. I do have problems with non ffls buying dozens of guns, never open them, just to flip them after another massacre. Funny the ATF agrees.

So, you do or don't care if people make money?

[TommyMN]

It's a straw purchase.

A straw purchase is when someone buys a firearm on behalf of another. Buying a firearm for yourself and selling it right away is perfectly fine.

Page 165. http://www.atf.gov/publications/downloa ... 5300-4.pdf

Is that why a simple google search shows the ATF arresting people all the time for operating without a liscense? You should email the info you got to the guys locked up.

[TommyMN]

I have no problem with people making $. Zero. make what you want. I do have problems with non ffls buying dozens of guns, never open them, just to flip them after another massacre. Funny the ATF agrees.

So, you do or don't care if people make money?

I do not agree with people breaking and skating the law for a few bucks after a massacre.

[Evad]

I have no problem with people making $. Zero. make what you want. I do have problems with non ffls buying dozens of guns, never open them, just to flip them after another massacre. Funny the ATF agrees.

So, you do or don't care if people make money?

I do not agree with people breaking and skating the law for a few bucks after a massacre.

So you are ok with prices as long as sales are legal? Good. What I saw from you before sort of looked like "HEY! That's more than I want to pay! NOT FAIR!". I am happy I misunderstood and you aren't simply attacking a registered FFL for something legal.

Let's be honest, I want a $700 AR also....but I will wait, and I will get one.

[Synergy]

This reminds me of the mid to late 90's when I was into collecting Hotwheels. There were guys hanging out at every store every morning waiting to go in and raid the Hotwheels. They would all end up at the toy shows and the price would be marked WAY up and people were buying them simply because it was a new model. After a month or so went by that same model was so plentiful in the stores you couldn't give them away. This still goes on today but has died way down.

People were spending money they didn't have on stuff they don't need if FEAR that they would never get it and the PERCEIVED impression that the value was only going up. Some Hotwheels actually did go up in value but 99% of them didn't.

Its almost the same thing in the gun/ammo world, not quite but almost. All I can tell you is that if your paying inflated prices because you FEAR never getting your item YOU WILL GET BURNED and will totally regret your overpriced purchase. Then you have lie about what you actually paid for it or look like a total dumbass LOL.

[jags]

Kind of like the housing fiasco? Better get one or you never will. You won't be able to afford it. Yeah that worked out pretty well.

[MNGunGuy]

It's a straw purchase.

A straw purchase is when someone buys a firearm on behalf of another. Buying a firearm for yourself and selling it right away is perfectly fine.

Page 165. http://www.atf.gov/publications/downloa ... 5300-4.pdf

Is that why a simple google search shows the ATF arresting people all the time for operating without a liscense? You should email the info you got to the guys locked up.

I have no idea what your Google searching comes up with, although if I had a chance to look at your history I'm sure I wouldn't be surprised.

All that aside, the fact remains your definition of a straw purchase is not correct. The ATF handbook I linked to gives a clear definition of what constitutes a straw purchase and simply reselling firearms bought for yourself is not one of them.

If you want to be mad at someone be mad at this guy who uses this forum to find ammo and mags at local Fleet Farms then tries to bend over the very members trying to help others. viewtopic.php?f=22&t=38290

[FJ540]

http://www.atf.gov/press/releases/2012/ ... crime.html

Looks like tax evasion was the primary point of charges. No citation for dealer level of transaction, other than the ATF claiming his volume of sales were high enough to warrant needing a license. Al Capone approach worked again.

“The prosecution of this individual should serve as a reminder to those who buy and sell guns, whether at gun shows or from their homes, that their income is taxable and must be reported,” said Kenneth J. Hines, the IRS Special Agent in Charge of the Pacific Northwest. “Tax cheating diminishes the government's ability to provide vital services to our communities. Tax crimes are not victimless.”

[FJ540]

http://www.atf.gov/regulations-rulings/ ... g-96-2.pdf

"The term “dealer” is defined at 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(11)(A) to include any person engaged in the business of selling firearms at wholesale or retail. The term “engaged in the business” as applied to a dealer in firearms means a person who devotes time, attention, and labor to dealing in firearms as a regular course of trade or business with the principal objective of livelihood and profit through the repetitive purchase and resale of firearms. A dealer can be “engaged in the business” without taking title to the firearms that are sold. However, the term does not include a person who makes occasional sales, exchanges, or purchases of firearms for the enhancement of a personal collection or for a hobby, or who sells all or part of his personal collection of firearms. 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(21)(C)."

This is pretty darn clear.

[xd9]

Yeah, NEVER F with the IRS and them getting their money. Worse than any gun laws being violated.

[XDM45]

Yeah, NEVER F with the IRS and them getting their money. Worse than any gun laws being violated.

Sorry to diverge the thread a second here, but I can attest to that.

My wife owned a business for 25 years (brick and mortar) and her then-husband ran an an accounting business, of which her business was a client. Well, long story made shorter,in 1995, he embezzled $150,000 due in sales tax (which they are so strict on sales tax has to be in a non-interest bearing account since it's illegal to make money off of taxes due toe government) .... anyway, her business needed $15k a month to break-even and to support the home and 3 daughters, another $5k for that, so $20k total a month just to break-even.... well, the IRS came to her store, guns drawn and shut her down. He had taken every cent - even out of the kids piggy-banks - and it all made thelocal newspapers. She had to borrow $30 from a neighboring business so she could open the very next day after working out a deal with the IRS.

Now over the next 7 years she had to come up with an additional $3,000-$3,500 a month to pay back the IRS all $150,000. So now that $20k became $23k, it was harder for her... plus no child support, no help from him, and she supportted herself, 3 daughters, a business, and no help from anyone else -- and in 7 years' time, she paid all that money back. Keep in mind in 1995 when all of this went down, she was told she had Lupus and was given 5-7 years to live and to avoid stress. In that same year, he dad died from Cancer.

xd9 is right. DO NOT F WITH THE IRS!!

I'm proud of my wife who has more medical issues than one should bare, and she's an inspiration to me and many. One tough lady whom I love dearly.

Ok, now not to derail the thread, I just wanted to give a real world situation regarding the IRS, yeah, don't mess with them indeed.

Other things to not mess with... the DNR, the DOT (both have more power than the police), student loans, and US Import/Export Laws.

[XDM45]

I have no problem with people making $. Zero. make what you want. I do have problems with non ffls buying dozens of guns, never open them, just to flip them after another massacre. Funny the ATF agrees.

From page 3 of this thread, it bares repeating here.

I agree 100%.

But when wannabe entrepreneurs can buy something from you for $500 on MN Guntalk and turn it around and anonymously sell it on AL for for $700, they will do it all day long.

Exactly. I 100% agree AngryBen.

Now to everyone else...........

You can offer to sell anything you want (legally) to anyone you want (legally) and if they agree to the price, ok. If not, ok.

If I offer someone $25.000 for an AR-15 and it's legal to transact it), would they say no? Maybe, but probably not. Why would anyone have a problem with that? Also, it's a free market, it's supply and demand. I'm sure there are a few people on here who could just write that check (myself included) and would we pay that for an AR-15 we even though we could? if we wanted it badly enough, yes, but otherwise, no. Money isn't the meaning of life, but it does give you options that you'd otherwise not have. If you have the money, you can buy things, but if not, then not. the more money you have, the more options you have, that's all.

My only regret is I didn't buy certain caliber ammo, guns and accessories at a lower price so I could offer them at a higher one now. Lesson learned. When prices do drop, I'll be there to horde .223 ammo, PMAGs, and whatever else I can get my hands on even though I don't own an AR-15. It's not personal, it's just business, and too many people on here are taking it personally and are offended because they think they have some god-given and constitutional RIGHT to pay a certain amount for something and because the 2A guarantees the right to bare arms. Some people think that 2A must state "to own them and all accessories at a cheap price too..." Well, big hint... it does NOT say that.

That's the core of it.. buy low and sell high, and know that gun prices aren't regulated (thank goodness for that!!)

By now I've probably po'd a few people off, but whatever. I'm just telling it like it is.

Ether buy low and sell high yourself next time, OR don't.

Either pay the prices now for what you want, OR don't.

Heck. I can *WANT* a Cadillac all day long for $20, but that doesn't mean I'll get it. If I want one, I need to pay for it. Sure, I want the best price I can get, but if that price is higher than what I think it should be and I can't negotiate a "better deal" (aka meaning the price *I* want) then I either need to pay it or walk away, that's all. I'm not going to effen whine about how I can't get that Caddy for $20. This is basic stuff and really doesn't need explaining, but I feel it does because so many people seem so outraged that they can't get guns, accessories, etc, or get them at the prices they want. boo hoo. I've seen way too much whining about how the prices are this, people are taking advantage of that, blah blah blah blah whiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiine oh cry me a river. I'm REALLY tried of it on here. Enough.... PLEASE. JUST. STOP.

Do I LIKE paying .45 a round instead of .25 for .45ACP? No, of course not... but doom on me for not buying it at .25 and selling it at .45 myself. Now I just picked up a ton of ammo to stockpile and to hedge my bet against even higher prices. Almost no one has that ammo in stock, let alone in any quantity of the most popular calibers - except for a very few such as lucky gunner where I bought my .45ACP. Even my .22LR from Cabellas is on back order. I paid more than I normally would, but that's ok. I get it. Supply and demand. So I dropped $900 on 2,000 rounds for .45ACP. Oh well. That's the way it is. I wanted the ammo, not the price I'd like at .25-.35 a round, but it is what it is. If someone can't afford that, then either get a new hobby, cut expenses elsewhere, (maybe give up those smokes or $5 coffees or cable or whatever), figure out how to make more money, but don't whine about it.

..and next, buy low and sell high yourself. I promise you won't be whining then.

[xd ED]

.... When prices do drop....

^^That won't happen because this will VV

I'll be there to horde .223 ammo, PMAGs, and whatever else I can get my hands on

It's not personal, it's just the marketplace

[TommyMN]

I'm starting to notice people struggle with reading comprehension.

[XDM45]

.... When prices do drop....

^^That won't happen because this will VV

I'll be there to horde .223 ammo, PMAGs, and whatever else I can get my hands on

It's not personal, it's just the marketplace

What is VV?

As for me hording, I know it's the marketplace...which is my point. As soon as I can buy low and sell high, I will (as should everyone who can.)