Keith Ellison is a angry man

[NMRMN]

Please share the Tea Party plan for Social Security.

:flag:

Cause you're actually going to take the time to do an analysis..

My time is better spent elsewhere.

Ah, so you say my characterization of the Tea Party ideas on Social Security are wrong.....but you can't even state what those ideas are?

You probably don't even know.

:booyah:

Olaf, arent you a little too old to act like a schoolyard punk?

[St. Olaf]

I'm retired.
I went to school on the G.I. Bill.
I have three retirement checks coming in (Social Security, Military and State) cheap dental insurance, plus free health insurance through Tri-Care and Medicare, plus investments that bring in an amount nearly equal to the dollar value of all that combined.
I'm in the catbird seat. I can do whatever I wish and buy pretty much whatever I want.
I earned and paid for every bit of it with a long, smart and successful career of hard work of over forty years.
I don't need anything from society. I've already got mine.
Your anger and bitterness make it sound like you're the one with the problems, but I guess that would go along with being a Tea Party follower.
Maybe if you'd start voting right and caring about the poor, the elderly, the vulnerable, the kids who deserve a good education and health care........you'd get some good Karma, too.

Well, first of all, I paid for my checks with money I paid into Social Security for forty years.

Unless you are unlucky and die early, you will get out far more than you paid in. Not sure how old you are, or your life expectancy, but the hard math of increasing benefits and longer lifespans does not add up. Combine that with the population bubble created by the baby boom, the smaller gen "X", and the "trust fund" being "borrowed against" for "investments" and you've got a perfect storm. Created equally by the cowardice and fiscal mismanagement of both parties over several decades. The piper will be here soon.

Not knowing the specifics of your career, it looks like a solid chunk (if not the majority) of your lifetime wage earnings and your defined retirement benefits came courtesy of the taxpayer via some form of civil service career. You're welcome.

I've read a pile of your posts, and (unlike many here) I don't think your a troll. I do think you have a limited point of view and offer simplistic solutions (more money for everything and tax the rich). Possibly your military and state government jobs leave you with a blind spot to who pays for what. I paid almost $50,000 in combined income and property taxes in 2012. Not sure about sales tax, but probably a $5000+ more. What is enough? With a family of four, good income, 8 years of kids college tuition starting this fall, saving for retirement (10-15 years), I don't think there's a lot of excess cash in my family's P&L. My income and savings are not a piggy bank for local, state, and federal government.

You're welcome to your own estimates, but what I paid in for over forty years plus interest should take me a long ways, and I'll probably die having paid enough for the next generation to have a little to get them started.

As for you, are you trying to say that you're among that above $400,000 income crowd that will have to pay a whopping four percent more income tax now?

[NMRMN]

You're welcome to your own estimates, but what I paid in for over forty years plus interest should take me a long ways, and I'll probably die having paid enough for the next generation to have a little to get them started.

Again, you can believe what you want, but were paying for your retirement right now -- get over it. Sounds like your just pissed to see your hard earned money go in one door of the government, never to be seen again.

[LePetomane]

I earned and paid for every bit of it with a long, smart and successful career of hard work of over forty years.

Do you think that you are the only one who has worked hard for what they have? Do you think that upper income earners (income wealthy, not trust fund types like the governor) steal or earn their income by way of dishonest doings? Your posts convey a disdain for anyone in the private sector with a healthy income.

[St. Olaf]

I do think you have a limited point of view and offer simplistic solutions (more money for everything and tax the rich).

Maybe we should just try the simple solutions first and if they don't work we can go for the more complicated ones.

Oh no......that would be too simple.



Keep in mind that we've been trying the complicated Republican "cut everything except defense and give huge tax breaks to the rich" since Reagan and all it got us is the Bush Recession.

At what point can you admit it failed?

[NMRMN]

I do think you have a limited point of view and offer simplistic solutions (more money for everything and tax the rich).

Maybe we should just try the simple solutions first and if they don't work we can go for the more complicated ones.

Oh no......that would be too simple.

:mrgreen:

Keep in mind that we've been trying the complicated Republican "cut everything except defense and give huge tax breaks to the rich" since Reagan and all it got us is the Bush Recession.

At what point can you admit it failed?

:cogitating:

Easy money, crony capitalism and democratic home ownership policy caused the "Bush" recession.

[LePetomane]

Easy money, crony capitalism and democratic home ownership policy caused the "Bush" recession.

It doesn't sound like it has been a recession for our sanctimonious friend who claims "I've already got mine".

[NMRMN]

Easy money, crony capitalism and democratic home ownership policy caused the "Bush" recession.

It doesn't sound like it has been a recession for our sanctimonious friend who claims "I've already got mine".

Yeah, you don't really need to worry about these things when the government employs you, insures you and supports you in retirement. It's really a great way to get votes. Too bad the rest of us have to pay for it.

edit: Im not referring to literally everyone who works for the gov, but rather that this system can be manipulated in order to achieve political ends. No offense to all honorable government workers out there: LE, MIL, even politicians -- thank you for your service to our country!

[St. Olaf]

I do think you have a limited point of view and offer simplistic solutions (more money for everything and tax the rich).

Maybe we should just try the simple solutions first and if they don't work we can go for the more complicated ones.

Oh no......that would be too simple.



Keep in mind that we've been trying the complicated Republican "cut everything except defense and give huge tax breaks to the rich" since Reagan and all it got us is the Bush Recession.

At what point can you admit it failed?

Easy money, crony capitalism and democratic home ownership policy caused the "Bush" recession.

That's a ludicrous and totally unfounded Fox News talking point.

[St. Olaf]

Easy money, crony capitalism and democratic home ownership policy caused the "Bush" recession.

It doesn't sound like it has been a recession for our sanctimonious friend who claims "I've already got mine".

Yeah, you don't really need to worry about these things when the government employs you, insures you and supports you in retirement. It's really a great way to get votes. Too bad the rest of us have to pay for it.

edit: Im not referring to literally everyone who works for the gov, but when this system is perpetrated in order to achieve political ends. No offense to all honorable government workers out there: LE, MIL, even politicians -- thank you for your service to our country!

Even with your backpedaling edit......you still look foolish.

Perhaps if you had made smarter career choices you wouldn't have to be flaunting your envy here.

[St. Olaf]

Easy money, crony capitalism and democratic home ownership policy caused the "Bush" recession.

It doesn't sound like it has been a recession for our sanctimonious friend who claims "I've already got mine".

Everybody lost in the Bush Recession.

Some of us were better prepared due to smart career choices.

[NMRMN]

Even with your backpedaling edit......you still look foolish.
Perhaps if you had made smarter career choices you wouldn't have to be flaunting your envy here.

listen JA. It was edited for clarity and so as not to offend anyone that I may have unintentionally offended -- Not to change the substance of the argument. Im not envious, and seeing that theres no way you know what my career or financial situation is, I can only conclude that you are still playing the schoolyard punk. Grow up and add something substantive to these discussions.

[LePetomane]

Some of us were better prepared due to smart career choices.

Career choices like a guaranteed State of Minnesota pension?

[45Badger]

You're welcome to your own estimates, but what I paid in for over forty years plus interest should take me a long ways, and I'll probably die having paid enough for the next generation to have a little to get them started.

As for you, are you trying to say that you're among that above $400,000 income crowd that will have to pay a whopping four percent more income tax now?

I've run the math on mine and I'd better live a long time

As for the 400K, nope. You don't need to earn anywhere near that to rack up my tax bill. Even if I did, that whopping 4%/16K is a years tuition at the U. I could put it to good (and probably more economically valuable/stimulative) use than the assorted government agencies I support.

Maybe we should just try the simple solutions first and if they don't work we can go for the more complicated ones.

Oh no......that would be too simple.



Keep in mind that we've been trying the complicated Republican "cut everything except defense and give huge tax breaks to the rich" since Reagan and all it got us is the Bush Recession.

At what point can you admit it failed?

You're countering points I did not make. To me, that's further evidence of the limited understanding. I'm no more a Republican fan-boy than the next guy in Minnesota. On the other hand, the Democrats are no better. Both are irresponsible. Based on visible and measurable outcomes, people in the US sure seem want more government than they say they are willing to pay for. Everybody is for cutting taxes and spending until their ox gets gored. Everybody wants "the rich" (who nobody seems to be wiling to clearly define by net worth or income) to pay their "fair" share. They pay a lot today. At some point, the house of cards will crash and we'll be forced to make honest choices on some real hard issues-

What is the role of the Federal, State, and local governments?
What do we "need" government to do at each level?
What do we "want" government to do at each level?
What level should be capable and responsible for what?
What (if anything) should each and any level of government spend on defense, education, social welfare, DNR, DMV, international aid, healthcare etc?
What is the best way to pay for those needs?
If we choose to have the wants, how do we pay for them?

I can hardly wait for that . I don't think the answers to any of those questions are "simple". I think a lot of people confuse wants with needs, just like confusing wants with rights (like my 17 year old ). We'll see how it all turns out. I'm pretty sure the longer we listen to the foaming at the mouth idiots on the far left and right, the harder we will fall. I'm blessed because I get to move to Illinois next summer and have my income tax rate drop by a couple points and my property tax rate double

I'm out. Later. Word.

[MNHandK]

Please share the Tea Party plan for Social Security.

Cause you're actually going to take the time to do an analysis..

My time is better spent elsewhere.

Ah, so you say my characterization of the Tea Party ideas on Social Security are wrong.....but you can't even state what those ideas are?

You probably don't even know.

Stating what the plan or ideas are would be pointless. You're not hear to try and learn anything or get your facts straight. You are likely completely incapable of doing an analysis of the financial impact of either plan. instead, in predictable lib fashion, relying on emotional statements that have no basis in fact that are meant to scare people.. because sadly the average american would rather trust the media or their government than do their own homework. The demigogory on Medicare and Medicaid.. SS.. the fiscal cliff, sequestration.. Missing from every lib argument were the facts and figures. Guess well just have to pass their bills again before we can figure out what is in them..

You sound as bad as Ellison. But that is probably just a fox talking point.