Why I abandoned the AR 15..............

[linksep]

Shoot the 600 prone with a factory stock <$650 AR, irons, and Tula ammo and get back to me...

Gotta be apples-to-apples comparison, otherwise you're talking about different philosophy of use (there I go dropping a quote from that complete ass-hat Nutinfancy).

I've shot 1000 meters with an rack M16 and irons. Does that count?

Sure does. Have you tried the same thing with an AK and ammo of similar quality to what you used with the AR?

Also are you punching paper or fighting for your life? At 600+ a 5.56 packs less energy than a 9mm at the muzzle.

Jerry Miculek can hit a baloon at 1,000 yards with a 9mm (by aiming 75-80 yards over the target)...... That doesn't mean it's the right tool for the job.

[linksep]

Show me a $100 AK.

Since you didn't call dibbs, I did.

[linksep]

Wow, the interweb never ceases to amaze. We can still argue AR vs AK till the cows come home. What's next? 1911 vs glock? 9mms vs 45?

Beretta 96 / Taurus 100 .40 Cal.

[linksep]

ARs and AKs:

That was kinda my point... but no...

The AR princesses will always look over their noses at the AK peons; and the AK peons will always resent the AR princess for their arrogance.

[Ghost]

Are we comparing a $100 AK to a $500 AR?
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/05/13/rifle-dynamics-upcoming-precision-ak-with-jim-fuller-and-travis-haley/

I will pay you $200 for every $100 functioning AK you can get your hands on. No limit.

But in 2017 dollars, no, I edited my post to say <$700 AR to be consistent with $600-$700 AK prices. (Can't compare a $700 AK to a $3,500 custom match-grade AR).

The one in goalie's picture was likely a sub $100 AK.

My point was not so much the price but what is the actual comparison? The AK's I've had experience with were made with 70 year old machines in $hithole countries so they aren't exactly a fair comparison to a PSA barreled AR made in 2017.

I don't care which ones people like better or who uses what but the traditional AK wasn't meant for 600 yard shooting, it was meant to be unloaded rapidly in the direction of an enemy by people who lived in huts, villages and jungles.

I have no idea if a modern build AK has been improved upon like the AR's of today, never seen, never desired one.

Anyway if you want to travel to Niger they are $75, Sudan they are $86, or even California they run about $400 for the real deal. Good luck
http://www.wander.agency/black-market-prices/

[Erud]

Shoot the 600 prone with a factory stock <$650 AR, irons, and Tula ammo and get back to me...

Gotta be apples-to-apples comparison, otherwise you're talking about different philosophy of use (there I go dropping a quote from that complete ass-hat Nutinfancy).

I've shot 1000 meters with an rack M16 and irons. Does that count?

Why are you measuring distance in meters, did you just move here from France or something?

[Holland&Holland]

Are we comparing a $100 AK to a $500 AR?
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/05/13/rifle-dynamics-upcoming-precision-ak-with-jim-fuller-and-travis-haley/

I will pay you $200 for every $100 functioning AK you can get your hands on. No limit.

But in 2017 dollars, no, I edited my post to say <$700 AR to be consistent with $600-$700 AK prices. (Can't compare a $700 AK to a $3,500 custom match-grade AR).

The one in goalie's picture was likely a sub $100 AK.

My point was not so much the price but what is the actual comparison? The AK's I've had experience with were made with 70 year old machines in $hithole countries so they aren't exactly a fair comparison to a PSA barreled AR made in 2017.

I don't care which ones people like better or who uses what but the traditional AK wasn't meant for 600 yard shooting, it was meant to be unloaded rapidly in the direction of an enemy by people who lived in huts, villages and jungles.

I have no idea if a modern build AK has been improved upon like the AR's of today, never seen, never desired one.

Anyway if you want to travel to Niger they are $75, Sudan they are $86, or even California they run about $400 for the real deal. Good luck
http://www.wander.agency/black-market-prices/

Maybe Trump will let CMP import them?

[Rip Van Winkle]

[gun_fan111v2]

I'd like to own an AK but no way I am paying $700 for a cheap knock-off import. Any news out of Kalashnikov USA?

[FJ540]

I'd like to own an AK but no way I am paying $700 for a cheap knock-off import. Any news out of Kalashnikov USA?

About a month out last I heard (which was last week).

[hard h2o]

Sure does. Have you tried the same thing with an AK and ammo of similar quality to what you used with the AR?

Also are you punching paper or fighting for your life? At 600+ a 5.56 packs less energy than a 9mm at the muzzle.

Jerry Miculek can hit a baloon at 1,000 yards with a 9mm (by aiming 75-80 yards over the target)...... That doesn't mean it's the right tool for the job.

Not fighting for my life. Punching paper. My purpose was training to be able to train other soldiers in marksmanship. It was more of a confidence builder in the weapons platform that it can indeed make hits at the distance if the rifleman does his job.

Sounds like I need a $2200 AK to do what I did with my rack grade M16.

That is why I think the author of the article should be comparing a .308 AR with a 7.62 AK. Or a 5.54 AK with a 5.56 AR.

[Uffdaphil]

Where do I start? The author knows the platform " inside and out" yet calls it maintenance intensive. Has he not seen the many examples of ARs running thousands of rounds with just lots of lube and an occassional bolt scrape? Then he portrays the plethora of options to fine tune a particular custom set-up as a negative.

" I need to have a weapon to operate in a close-quarters environment without worry about lubrication, jamming, buffer weights, or springs." Any stock quality factory mil-spec AR will not jam with good defensive ammo. Nor is there any worry about standard carbine gassed spring/buffer combo. If the dork really knew the platform he would not be confused by all the possible combinations.

My favorite line: "I only need to stock one style of spring, the same one used by most of the 100 million AK-47s that have been produced. This makes my overhead for long-term support of my rifles considerably less." How many springs does he think he will wear out? Big savings there.

That said, I like the AKs too, just not as my only CQB, SHTF gun. His AKM is long, heavy, cleaning intensive (w/corrosive ammo), has inferior iron sights and optics mounting options, and would be much harder to find parts and ammo in bad times. Get both.

[hard h2o]

Why are you measuring distance in meters, did you just move here from France or something?

That is the way my uncle measured his range.

I guess I could have said 1093.613 yards.

[hard h2o]

Where do I start? The author knows the platform " inside and out" yet calls it maintenance intensive. Has he not seen the many examples of ARs running thousands of rounds with just lots of lube and an occassional bolt scrape? Then he portrays the plethora of options to fine tune a particular custom set-up as a negative.

" I need to have a weapon to operate in a close-quarters environment without worry about lubrication, jamming, buffer weights, or springs." Any stock quality factory mil-spec AR will not jam with good defensive ammo. Nor is there any worry about standard carbine gassed spring/buffer combo. If the dork really knew the platform he would not be confused by all the possible combinations.

My favorite line: "I only need to stock one style of spring, the same one used by most of the 100 million AK-47s that have been produced. This makes my overhead for long-term support of my rifles considerably less." How many springs does he think he will wear out? Big savings there.

That said, I like the AKs too, just not as my only CQB, SHTF gun. His AKM is long, heavy, cleaning intensive (w/corrosive ammo), has inferior iron sights and optics mounting options, and would be much harder to find parts and ammo in bad times. Get both.

That makes me believe he is not so HSLD as he lets on. I myself am very HDLS. I am the most tactical printing press operator who has ever served in the U.S. armed forces and I can even see through the B.S.

[shooter115]

Guy lost me as soon as he started talking about buffers. A carbine length gas system will typically run on everything from an H3 buffer to a completely gutted H1. I know this because I've tried it. Two of my rifles have been running for years with no weights in the buffer. Shoot you can even replace your buffer with a little piece of Delrin and it will run just fine. On top of all that, I've never even seen a buffer worn out to the point it was no longer functional. My very first AR, my varmint rig, is about 20 years old, 10's of thousands of rounds, it's third barrel is getting tired and needs to be replaced. Same buffer and spring. Other than the finish worn off the face it looks like brand new. I should replace the spring but it's getting a JP silent capture spring as soon as my range thaws.