The Truth about 6.5 Ammo

[crbutler]

Ghost isn't the only one who has seen those quotes. I've heard them too. He's not inventing anything. I just disagree with his sources (of those quotes)...

One common thread by most who have done the Grendel on long range elk is that the have a financial or family interest in a maker or sales of Grendel rifles. I know Alexander (of AAC) taped a hunt of him killing an elk at some godawful range. That was a stunt.

I don't disagree the Grendel is a very capable round, it's just not a moose or elk gun, and Ghost is agreeing there.

I would have no hesitation shooting a deer at 4-500 yards if the rifle was capable with a Grendel and good ammo, assuming I needed the meat. (But I really would do my damnedest to get to half that if I could)...

I also would have no concerns shooting an elk with a .264 win mag or a .26 nosler. Moose, well no. Not even with a fast 6.5, but I have better choices.

[acs75]

Yes ghost has produced these quotes. He agrees with them. Otherwise why would you post them.
As you do I disagree with them and taking animal at those ranges. With any caliber. Especially 6.5 grendal or anything comparable. Now you bring Elk n Moose into it. That IS unethical.
That IS the debate here. There are to many variables for those kind of distances.

If you NEED the meat that will change the narrative SLIGHTLY.

I have been consistent use the right tool for the job. Be ethical about the choices you're making.

Yes Erud I am passionate about that. I'm not just a small Troll!

[Ghost]

I'll find the link tomorrow, AR's are irrelevant as 6.5's are not just AR's.

Yes, but you are using this as evidence that the Grendal performs at this level. The grendal is not in the same performance category as the creedmore, the .260 or even a hunting round in Swede.

Get your story straight.

Grendel is available in bolt actions, not only AR's. More manufacturers are bringing them out the round hasn't even been SAAMI for 10 years.
https://www.legacysports.com/catalog/howa/howa-mini-action-rifle/



Then back to AR's you have CMMG bringing out the ANVIL which seems to imply they want people to start increasing pressures closer to creedmoor levels, not sure I agree with this.

The MkW ANVIL platform is designed to properly handle calibers with large casing diameters and significant bolt thrust. Built on CMMG’s ultra-durable mid-sized platform and featuring the unique PowerBOLT design, the ANVIL is designed to harness the full potential of calibers such as the 6.5 Grendel. While the bolt carrier group is based on CMMG’s Mk3, the unique lower receiver is designed to accept AR15-sized magazines. The receivers are made from 7075-T6 aluminum and each rifle comes with a 10-round magazine. The 6.5 Grendel cartridge has quickly staked its claim as a viable cartridge for hunting medium-to large-sized game, as well as a consistent long-range performer. Great for both applications, the MkW ANVIL in 6.5 Grendel is overbuilt yet lightweight and is backed by CMMG’s Lifetime Guarantee.

[acs75]

Ghost you were only talking about AR-15. Not just any AR-15 an SBR!

You certainly are backing away from your stance on this. Why is that.

[Ghost]

Yes ghost has produced these quotes. He agrees with them. Otherwise why would you post them.
As you do I disagree with them and taking animal at those ranges. With any caliber. Especially 6.5 grendal or anything comparable. Now you bring Elk n Moose into it. That IS unethical.
That IS the debate here. There are to many variables for those kind of distances.

If you NEED the meat that will change the narrative SLIGHTLY.

I have been consistent use the right tool for the job. Be ethical about the choices you're making.

Yes Erud I am passionate about that. I'm not just a small Troll!

Lol, your reading comprehension is lacking. You are comprehending what you want out of those quotes not what I wrote.

One specific point: yes the Grendel round is very similar to the traditional 6.5 x 55 swede, don't get confused by the recent higher pressure loadings. I'm talking about the one that has been killing moose for over a century.

I've already said I wouldn't personally take a Grendel elk hunting but I've also said it can be done and many elk will be taken this year with the round.

[Ghost]

Ghost you were only talking about AR-15. Not just any AR-15 an SBR!

You certainly are backing away from your stance on this. Why is that.

I was comparing an SBR Grendel to a 6.8.

[acs75]

Yes ghost has produced these quotes. He agrees with them. Otherwise why would you post them.
As you do I disagree with them and taking animal at those ranges. With any caliber. Especially 6.5 grendal or anything comparable. Now you bring Elk n Moose into it. That IS unethical.
That IS the debate here. There are to many variables for those kind of distances.

If you NEED the meat that will change the narrative SLIGHTLY.

I have been consistent use the right tool for the job. Be ethical about the choices you're making.

Yes Erud I am passionate about that. I'm not just a small Troll!

Lol, your reading comprehension is lacking. You are comprehending what you want out of those quotes not what I wrote.

One specific point: yes the Grendel round is very similar to the traditional 6.5 x 55 swede, don't get confused by the recent higher pressure loadings. I'm talking about the one that has been killing moose for over a century.

I've already said I wouldn't personally take a Grendel elk hunting but I've also said it can be done and many elk will be taken this year with the round.

lol that's funny! Taking yourself out of context. That only few can do.


You have been comparing 6.5 grendal to all of these. That it can run with them
The grendal is no where near the class off 6.5x55.

When you post something you are saying that you agree with that statement. Why else would you consistently make those statements

[Ghost]

Utah requires 500 ft lbs at 100 yards with a minimum of .24 caliber in a handgun. Rifle is any center fire.

Ok. Legal is a .17 hornet rifle. Don't be stupid.

How many elk have you shot? How much money would be sufficient for hunt cost before you would start moving up from a 6.5 Grendel (meaning a guided hunt where most outfitters say if you draw blood, that's your animal, you are done with a wounded bull)?

The Grendel is a good long range steel swatter, a good all around deer/pronghorn round, but a marginal elk round, and in my opinion, an unethical long range elk round. It's also not a moose cartridge. Yes it can kill anything that walks, as can a .22 short... but that does not make it a good hunting round.

Before you trot out that canard about Europeans and the 6.5x55, remember that the European moose is about 70% the size of a Alaskan or Siberian moose, they are shot at very close range, and they are generally hunting with dogs (elghunds) so a wounded animal is almost always found. The 6.5 when used on moose is generally with a 160 grain bullet, which is also a bit out of the range of the Grendel's oal.

As to which upper, whichever works better for you. The cheap one may shoot well, while the expensive one may be so so. Personally, I have found you generally get what you pay for, but then again, fortunately for me $200 on my hunting rifle is not a matter of significant debate so I am not the guy to ask about budget choices.

From what I am seeing, yukonjasper is after an AR deer and maybe pronghorn gun as a range rifle. The Grendel will work excellently for that. I realize most are not going to do the level and amount of traveling hunting I do, which colors my thinking a bit, but of the new guys I see in elk hunts, all of them are hauling new .300 or .338s so it seems that if you can afford the $5000 for the hunt, you can afford a new gun for elk. All of the guys I have met hunting elk with a Grendel (all one of them) were industry comped writers. What he wrote was rather different than what I heard from the guide, and that really colors my thinking on that rifle choice. I will go so far as to say even if you paid for me to hunt elk or moose with a Grendel, I would not. I have too much respect for the animal.

I'm not an elk hunter nor would I take a Grendel for elk, I never said I would.

Yes, moose in Scandinavia are about 70% the size of an Alaskan and trust me I've been within 20 feet of Alaskan so I realize how big they are, they even came up and licked the windows of our cabin. So Scandinavian moose are about the size of an elk. I just bought moose in the store while in Norway, way easier than hunting.

The other thing to note on Scandinavia is that they did a study to see how far moose went after being shot and interestingly it was the .40+ caliber first followed by the 6.5's and 7's, the .300's ranked last as in the moose traveled the furthest after being shot.

I would like to see that study, please post.

I did not realize they allowed ARs in Scandinavia.

Link looks to be dead, it's available here though with discussion

https://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=274220

[acs75]

Let me get this straight. I want to make sure I fully understand your position.
You are recommending something to someone else that you Aren't Willing to do.

That's F Ed UP!!!!!

[Ghost]

Let me get this straight. I want to make sure I fully understand your position.
You are recommending something to someone else that you Aren't Willing to do.

That's F Ed UP!!!!!

Where did I say anyone should go shoot an elk with a Grendel?

This was/is a discussion on the 6.5 caliber and their different offerings and their capabilities.

[acs75]

I just quoted you in it. Seriously man that not right.

You can't even read your quotes.


You said again I quote

Many whitetails have been taken in 300-500 yard range. Elk at 400+.

That's what you said. Which means you believe that people can/should be able to take elk at 400+ yards. With 6.5 grendal.


This is why this debate is happening lol

[acs75]

So I'm wondering what the ideal barrel length for a hunting Grendel upper should be? I figured I should know just in case I stumbled upon a great deal.

Thank you.

Are you interested in an SBR, if so 10.5" or 12"/12.5". If not, a 16" or 18" is all you need.

Where does it say 6.8?

[Ghost]

I just quoted you in it. Seriously man that not right.

You can't even read your quotes.


You said again I quote

Many whitetails have been taken in 300-500 yard range. Elk at 400+.

That's what you said. Which means you believe that people can/should be able to take elk at 400+ yards. With 6.5 grendal.


This is why this debate is happening lol

You are implying something I didn't say, I do believe people can, I never said they should.

But here's some more fuel for your fire

How does a creedmoor shooting 129 gr bullet 603 yards compare to a Grendel shooting the same bullet at say 400?

[Ghost]

So I'm wondering what the ideal barrel length for a hunting Grendel upper should be? I figured I should know just in case I stumbled upon a great deal.

Thank you.

Are you interested in an SBR, if so 10.5" or 12"/12.5". If not, a 16" or 18" is all you need.

Where does it say 6.8?

The comparison was back where I posted the "fun fact"

Do you happen to have a blood pressure cuff handy? If so can you check to confirm you are doing ok?

EDIT: Oh and I do believe a 12" suppressed Grendel is ideal for hunting in MN

[acs75]

Implying! You won't even stand by your own statements.

Why would any tell someone who is asking for advice on what to buy. That they can shoot that rifle/caliber at that range at that animal and not agree with it.
Messed up!